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#61 [Permalink] Posted on 24th August 2018 02:35
Hudhayfah said, "The Prophet said, 'I know more about the powers which the Dajjal will have than he will know himself. He will have two flowing rivers: one will appear to be pure water, and the other will appear to be flaming fire. Whosoever lives to see that, let him choose the river which seems to be fire, then let him close his eyes, lower his head and drink from it, for it will be cold water. The Dajjal will be one-eyed; the place where one eye should be will be covered by a piece of skin. On his forehead will be written the word Kafir, and every believer, whether literate or illiterate, will be able to read it.'" (Muslim)

Quote:
every believer, whether literate or illiterate, will be able to read it.'


Do we need scientific explanations to understand his fitnah or do we need eman to recognize him?
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#62 [Permalink] Posted on 24th August 2018 02:47
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Exactly this is the time for preparation and not talks.

Join a gym,
Learn Karate
Learn how to shoot
Buy licensed weapons and ammunition
Migrate to countryside
Learn to live without electronics and technology if the need arises. Like keeping a fast of no internet, no mobile for once a week.
Habit of plenty of dhikr and tilawah.
This modern life is creating girly soft "men" and masculine "women". Avoid it as much as possible.
Pure diet. No trash food.
Spend an hour or two in masjid daily. That is our last sanctuary in this modern chaotic age.
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#63 [Permalink] Posted on 24th August 2018 03:57
sipraomer wrote:
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salaam

definitely, without a doubt, the most important thing is to strengthen our iman. everything else comes second.
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#64 [Permalink] Posted on 24th August 2018 04:17
The point is what is prophetic advice for facing this fitna?

1. We can't defeat dajjal by debating with him that look you are not god and these are just tricks and we have this or that scientific explanation for it. He will be the best of debators and will have the best scientists at his disposal to counter our arguements.

2. We can't defeat dajjal through magic because he will have the best of magicians at his disposal.

3. We can't defeat dajjal with strength because he will have all the material forces to fight us.

4. First of all, we are instructed to avoid him completely. However, if we are unable to do so then we are instructed to recite the first or last 10 ayaat of surah kahaf. The first ten verses are giving a message of isolating oneself from a society who has rebelled against Tauheed and Allah. So even though we fail to migrate to the mountains there will be a kind of spiritual protection because of those verses. So even if he succeeds in killing us (We will eventually have to die one day), he will not succeed in making us deviate from the straight path and this is his mission.

5. When Imam Fakhruddin Razi Rh was confronted by devil at his death time, Imam Razi Rh gave 99 reasons for the existence of Allah and the devil refuted all those reasons. When Imam Razi's rh stock of arguments ran out, his faith got endangered. At this time his shaykh came to know his mureed's situation through kashaf and he told the great Imam that say this to the devil that "I believe in Allah without any reason". When the Imam did what his shaykh told him to do, the devil ran away, the Imam recited kalimah and went to his lord.
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#65 [Permalink] Posted on 24th August 2018 04:26
sipraomer wrote:
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best thing to do would be to join with the community of the most righteous muslims.
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#66 [Permalink] Posted on 24th August 2018 08:42
[QUOTE:xs11ax]
salaam

Quote:
even now its possible to revive a person once their heart has stopped. i believe they actually class that as bringing back someone from the dead. so it will depend on what dajjal will term as death. the mere stopping of the heart or the actual leaving of the soul from the body. correct me if im wrong, but isnt total disconnection of the soul from the body the real death? so maybe the death that dajjal will inflict on this person wont be actual death at all. i.e the soul wont have left the body, but merely the heart would have briefly stopped. allah hu alam.


I am a doctor by profession. Stopping of the heart and unconsciousness produced from it due to reduced blood supply to the brain, has a very narrow window of revival.This is not considered death but is known as coma/unconsciousness. Brain death occurs within 15-20 minutes after stopping of the heart.
Death is announced following Flat ECG tracings. We don't usually revive a dead heart.But we do revive the heart that is arrythmic (Contracting irregularly but Not pumping blood).


Secondly this deception (Raising the dead) of Dajjal will not be limited to people who he has inflicted death upon. It would include people who died from natural causes and even to those whose death has taken place before Dajjal's arrival. (See Hadith below)

The hadith on the other hand mentions
Quote:

According to the hadeeth of Umaamah al-Baahili (may Allaah be pleased with him), the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said of the Dajjaal: “Part of his fitnah will be that he will say to a Bedouin, Do you think that if I resurrect your father and mother for you that you will testify that I am your lord?’ He will say, ‘Yes.’ So two devils will appear to him in the image of his father and mother, saying, ‘O my son, follow him for he is your lord.’” (Narrated by Ibn Maajah, no. 4067. Classed as saheeh by al-Albaani, Saheeh al-Jaami’ al-Sagheer, hadeeth 7752).


So it will be revival from death and not from unconsciousness.

What do you think of Human cloning? May be this fits the picture.
Allah knows best
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#67 [Permalink] Posted on 24th August 2018 10:26
Scientists cloned a sheep by the name of Dolly. This is different from IVF. This is because in IVF egg is taken from the mother and sperm from the father and fused together and later implanted as an empryo in a surrogate mother.

In cloning they take cells from any part of the body. In dolly's case, the cells (Donor) were taken from the udder. It's nucleus was removed. Another egg was taken and it's nucleus was also removed. Then the nucleus(Donor) of the cells taken from the udder was transferred to the egg. This was then placed in a surrogate.
See the video below
www.youtube.com/watch?v=q0B9Bn1WW_4
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#68 [Permalink] Posted on 24th August 2018 10:37

saa10245 wrote:
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xs11ax wrote:
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Dajjalic Machinations Part 9: Revival of dead?


Read this first.

  1. It is likely that Dajjal will not only possess scientific and technological skillset but will also be aided by Shaytaan, Jinn and the forces of evil. We have limited knowledge of this evil world (physically) and it is the not the domain of science.
  2. The opinions expressed in this thread are an opinion, you are encouraged to disagree.
  3. These are to the best of my understanding in August 2018, therefore a point in time opinion. 

Background:

This section deals with possibility of how Dajjal can revive someone from being dead!


Revival?

It is not possible to revive someone who has died now and nor will it ever be possible. When brain stem death occurs, revival is impossible and this will not change in the future no matter how technologically advance science becomes.

There are only a few possibilities which potentially exist as to how Dajjal can pull this stunt:

  1. Allah Ta’ala may give potential ability to Dajjal (for one time) to do this. Allah Ta’ala temporarily granted special powers to Shaytaan to test Prophet Ayyub (AS) and this could be something temporary. This may be a probable scenario.
  2. No Shaytaan or Jinn can do this either
  3. It CANNOT be cloning because cloning requires time. Assuming that Dajjal will kill an adult person, it is not possible to immediately clone this dead adult, cloning is done at cellular at a simplistic level and you can take the data from the adult and fuse it with an embryo (baby) and then that baby may grow up to be a clone of the adult. This requires extremely complex setup and time and not something Dajjal will be able to pull in front of an audience immediately.
  4. The person Dajjal will revive will not be brain stem dead so there can be some sort of revival which is (medically) possible but then this will not be amazing or appear to be miraculous
  5. This will likely to be a trick assisted by Shaytaan and Jinn. Shaytaan or Jinn can even take the form and appearance of a dead person. This may be a probable scenario. 
  6. Abu Muhammad has suggested that another possibility is that Dajjal may alter perception of masses by using hypnosis or some other means. . This may also be a probable scenario.

Nobody can give life or take life except Allah.


What is cloning?

  1. Cloning is not giving life. It is taking existing life and modifying it and you can do it from DNA recovered from species long dead but you still need an embryo.
  2. Cloning produces a baby and does not produce an adult (it’s too complex) so the baby grows up to be a “potential clone” of the adult OR you can modify and create some differences. 
  3. As science advances, you may be able to clone long extinct species but that is still not creating life!
  4. As it stands and in the world of real science, you may never be able to clone a fully grown adult instantly. For example there is a 67 year old man and you want him cloned to be a 67 year old man and you want it done in 5 minutes, not possible and may not ever be possible! 

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#69 [Permalink] Posted on 24th August 2018 10:42
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I've heard in talks as you mentioned in point 4 that it will be the Jinn that will be in the form of a dead body and made to come back alive again. That's the only explanation that makes sense. Once the soul has left, it's gone!
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#70 [Permalink] Posted on 24th August 2018 10:59
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salaam

as far as i am aware dajjal will only be given the ability to revive a dead person just once, the hadith that you quoted actually says that jinns will take the appearance of dead people to deceive us into thinking he has revived other dead people. it doesnt say anything about actually reviving dead people.

like colonel said, maybe this is a one time ability that allah will grant him in order to test the people, or it might just be another deception of his as he is after all the greatest deceiver.
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#71 [Permalink] Posted on 24th August 2018 11:20
saa10245 wrote:
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It will be neither cloning ( He will do it right in front of the people without spending a lot of time on it or resorting to any technical add,cloning requires time and a hospital/ Laboratory) nor will it be revival from deep coma (He will KILL a particular person by thrashing him into two parts and then give him life again).That is how he will play god....

Resuscitation from cardiac arrest is a routine thing for doctors,none of them is ever been labelled as Dajjal :)

Ml Rafi Usmani writes in his book with reference to Muslim,Ibne Maja etc that Dajjal will kill a young man with sword or some other sharp object into two pieces and then revive him again....and ask him,’Do you now believe me to be your god ?’..the main will laugh and reply :’Now I am even more sure you are Dajjal’....Dajjal will try to kill him again BUT WILL NOT BE ABLE TO DO IT
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#72 [Permalink] Posted on 24th August 2018 11:42

mkdon101 wrote:
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This is just my opinion based on guess work and hypothesis so please disagree.

Narrated Anas bin Malik (RA) narrated that the Prophet (ṣallā llāhu ʿalayhi wa-sallam) said, "There will be no town which Ad-Dajjal will not enter except Mecca and Medina, and there will be no entrance (road) (of both Mecca and Medina) but the angels will be standing in rows guarding it against him, and then Medina will shake with its inhabitants thrice (i.e. three earthquakes will take place) and Allah will expel all the non-believers and the hypocrites from it." [Bukhari]

I believe that Dajjal will or may actually visit other places and this is not talking about his reach (via Media/Internet) because the Media/Internet reaches Makkah and Madina (today). I have lived in Saudi Arabia so the less said about this topic of Media/Internet in Makkah and Madina, the better.

All of the vulgarity and falsehood is unfortunately available in the two cities and accessible.

Since the Hadeeth explicitly talks about Dajjal will not be able to enter the two cities, I think that it is talking about physical visits.
Dajjal will assume some sort of leadership position/role in the future and by virtue of his position he will probably go around the world. He will not be allowed to enter Makkah and Madina. His propaganda will of course enter the two cities and people will be influenced by it.

Shaytaan cannot destory any city let alone Makkah or Madina.

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#73 [Permalink] Posted on 24th August 2018 11:54
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Shaytaan cannot destory any city let alone Makkah or Madina

But he can make them abandon them!

Isn't there a Hadith about Hajj being abandoned towards the end of times?
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#74 [Permalink] Posted on 24th August 2018 12:08
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Aoa Brother Muadh I have a question.

Quote:
There are only a few possibilities which potentially exist as to how Dajjal can pull this stunt:

Allah Ta’ala may give potential ability to Dajjal (for one time) to do this. Allah Ta’ala temporarily granted special powers to Shaytaan to test Prophet Ayyub (AS) and this could be something temporary. This may be a probable scenario.
No Shaytaan or Jinn can do this either
It CANNOT be cloning because cloning requires time. Assuming that Dajjal will kill an adult person, it is not possible to immediately clone this dead adult, cloning is done at cellular at a simplistic level and you can take the data from the adult and fuse it with an embryo (baby) and then that baby may grow up to be a clone of the adult. This requires extremely complex setup and time and not something Dajjal will be able to pull in front of an audience immediately.
The person Dajjal will revive will not be brain stem dead so there can be some sort of revival which is (medically) possible but then this will not be amazing or appear to be miraculous
This will likely to be a trick assisted by Shaytaan and Jinn. Shaytaan or Jinn can even take the form and appearance of a dead person. This may be a probable scenario.


Question
If you look at the hadiths.

Quote:

According to the hadeeth of Umaamah al-Baahili (may Allaah be pleased with him), the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said of the Dajjaal: “Part of his fitnah will be that he will say to a Bedouin, Do you think that if I resurrect your father and mother for you that you will testify that I am your lord?’ He will say, ‘Yes.’ So two devils will appear to him in the image of his father and mother, saying, ‘O my son, follow him for he is your lord.’” (Narrated by Ibn Maajah, no. 4067. Classed as saheeh by al-Albaani, Saheeh al-Jaami’ al-Sagheer, hadeeth 7752).

From this hadith we seem to understand that the dead people that Dajjal apparently resurrects will be nothing but shayateen who will be disguised in the image of dead people to deceive the masses.

On the other hand there are two other hadiths where Dajjal actually kills the person and brings him back to life.

Quote:
He would come but would not be allowed to enter the mountain passes to Medina. So he will alight at some of the barren tracts near Medina, and a person who would be the best of men or one from amongst the best of men would say to him: I bear testimony to the fact that you are Dajjal about whom Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) had informed us. The Dajjal would say: What is your opinion if I kill this (person), then I bring him back to life; even then will you harbour doubt in this matter? They would say: No. He would then kill (the man) and then bring him back to life. When he would bring that person to life, he would say: By Allah, I had no better proof of the fact (that you are a Dajjal) than at the present time (that you are actually so). The Dajjal would then make an attempt to kill him (again) but he would not be able to do that. Abu Ishaq reported that it was said: That person would be Khadir (Allah be pleased with him)
Reference : Sahih Muslim 2938 a
In-book reference : Book 54, Hadith 138
USC-MSA web (English) reference : Book 41, Hadith 7017
(deprecated numbering scheme)


In this hadith the person is split into two.
Quote:

Abu Sa'id al-Khudri reported Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) as saying:
The Dajjal would come forth and a person from amongst the believers would go towards him and the armed men of the Dajjal would meet him and they would say to him: Where do you intend to go? He would say: I intend to go to this one who is coming forth. They would say to him: Don't you believe in our Lord? He would say: There is nothing hidden about our Lord. They would say: Kill him. Then some amongst them would say: Has your master (Dajjal) not forbidden you to kill anyone without (his consent)? And so they would take him to the Dajjal and when the believer would see him, he would say: O people. he is the Dajjil about whom Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) has informed (us). The Dajjal would then order for breaking his head and utter (these words): Catch hold of him and break his head. He would be struck even on his back and on his stomach. Then the Dajjal would ask him: Don't you believe in me? He would say: You are a false Masih. He would then order him to be torn (into pieces) with a saw from the parting of his hair up to his legs. After that the Dajjal would walk between the two pieces. He would then say to him: Stand, and he would stand erect. He would then say to him: Don't you believe in me? And the person would say: It has only added to my insight concerning you (that you are really the Dajjal). He would then say: O people, he would not behave with anyone amongst people (in such a manner) after me. The Dajjal would try to catch hold of him so that he should kill him (again). The space between his neck and collar bone would be turned into copper and he would find no means to kill him. So he would catch hold of him by his hand and feet and throw him (into the air) and the people would think as if he had been thrown in the Hell-Fire whereas he would be thrown in Paradise. Thereupon Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) said: He would be the most eminent amongst persons in regard to martyrdom in the eye of the Lord of worlds.


Reference : Sahih Muslim 2938 c
In-book reference : Book 54, Hadith 140
USC-MSA web (English) reference : Book 41, Hadith 7019
(deprecated numbering scheme)


So is the revival of the dead by Dajjal based on
1) Decpetion/mirage i.e. shayateen wearing disguises to deceive the masses.
2) Actual revival. (as in the case of the man who would reject Dajjal)
3) or both.
???
Obviously we muslims believe all of this would take place by the will of Allah سبحانه وتعالى.

Pertaining to cloning: There was a movie i watched (i wouldnt mention the name). It had elements of cloning in it. In that movie, the bad people seemed to have found the trick of speeding up the process of cloning (took a matter of an hour or two). We never know if this can really happen in future. Allah knows best.

2nd question:
You said
Quote:
Cloning is not giving life. It is taking existing life and modifying it and you can do it from DNA recovered from species long dead but you still need an embryo.
Cloning produces a baby and does not produce an adult (it’s too complex) so the baby grows up to be a “potential clone” of the adult OR you can modify and create some differences.

I agree with all of the above. But does the cloned animal have a soul? From what i understand,Since the cloned animal is a living thing and all living things have a soul. it does. And it is given to it by Allahسبحانه وتعالى. What is your opinion?

@brother xs11ax
Quote:

salaam

as far as i am aware dajjal will only be given the ability to revive a dead person just once, the hadith that you quoted actually says that jinns will take the appearance of dead people to deceive us into thinking he has revived other dead people. it doesnt say anything about actually reviving dead people.

like colonel said, maybe this is a one time ability that allah will grant him in order to test the people, or it might just be another deception of his as he is after all the greatest deceiver.


Read the hadiths (from Sahih Muslim) above.
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#75 [Permalink] Posted on 24th August 2018 12:09
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He will ‘physically’ reach the holy places you mentioned but will not be able to enter because ANGELS will be guarding all the entry points to the two holy cities.Will his followers take it as his weakness,probably NOT...

His followers will not be able to see the Angels guarding the cities,Dajjal May or may not be seeing the Angels but will certainly know he is helpless,being a master of deception he can make any excuse for not ‘wanting’ to enter the two holy cities,instead,in case of Madina Munawwara على صاحبه الصلوات والسلام He will jolt the city three times (may be out of utter frustration),those with weak Eeman will leave the city and fall into his trap...

He will look at the outline of Masjid e Nabawai على صاحبه الصلوات والسلام from a distance and ask “What is that white palace visible to me ?” He will be told :” That is the masjid of AHMAD”( صَل الله عليه و سلم).

It is interesting to note that the name AHMAD صَل الله عليه و سلم is used here and not MUHAMMAD ( صَل الله عليه و سلم). Please recall the ayaat in Quran :

وَإِذْ قَالَ عِيسَى ابْنُ مَرْيَمَ يَا بَنِي إِسْرَائِيلَ إِنِّي رَسُولُ اللَّهِ إِلَيْكُم مُّصَدِّقًا لِّمَا بَيْنَ يَدَيَّ مِنَ التَّوْرَاةِ وَمُبَشِّرًا بِرَسُولٍ يَأْتِي مِن بَعْدِي اسْمُهُ أَحْمَدُ

Dajjal,being the false messiah of Jews will understand the significance of the name AHMAD,more than any other Jew:)

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