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Salaam111
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#1 [Permalink] Posted on 13th October 2021 19:52
Assalamu Alaykum, is there such thing as a good bidah? People say because Yahya (as) was born in a blessed day - all Prophets were born on a blessed day - is this true? Would Abu Lahabs punishment reduce because of freeing a slave while celebrating the birth of the Prophet (ﷺ). And did Shah Waliullah رحمة الله عليه celebrate Mawlid? And finally because we remember Prophet Musa (as) in the day of Ashura and fast, why is this/this not an argument for Mawlid.
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#2 [Permalink] Posted on 13th October 2021 20:46
Salaam111 wrote:
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We celebrate the Prophets existence by following his Sunnah, reviving his Sunnah, fasting on Mondays, teaching his seerah and so on. All of this is backed by evidence even from deviant schools.

We don't invent new customs borrowed from Christians and Jews and other religions. In fact, the hadith forbid us from doing that
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#3 [Permalink] Posted on 13th October 2021 21:06
abu mohammed wrote:
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Jazakallahu Khayran for your comment. I have a question though, why out of all the muqallids in today’s society only the deobandis are against mawlid? Are there non-deobandis who are against mawlids who aren’t Salafi?
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#4 [Permalink] Posted on 13th October 2021 21:14
I think more important question is HOW you celebrate mawlid? And what date do you accept as the birth date of Rasulullah صلی الله عليه وسلم?
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#5 [Permalink] Posted on 13th October 2021 21:24
Quote:
why out of all the muqallids in today’s society only the deobandis are against mawlid?

Can you name anyone in the first three generations that celebrated the Mawlid? (They were Muqallids too) (you can add a few generations if you want)

Can I also suggest you use the search facility to find more threads on Mawlid/Milad

Plenty of details there, eg www.muftisays.com/forums/13-articles--stories--more/4201-...
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#6 [Permalink] Posted on 13th October 2021 23:39
abu mohammed wrote:
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Jazakallahu Khayran for the link. One question though why are most of these African/Arab/Turkish scholars celebrate mawlid yet some deobandi scholars go study under them and heavily praise them even though they’re promoting bidah? Also isn’t the link just copy and pasted from IslamWeb?
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#7 [Permalink] Posted on 14th October 2021 08:04
Salaam111 wrote:
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A good question to go and ask those individual scholars you mention. Considering you take into account the question you have not answered.

Most articles are from other sources. We are not scholars in order for us to produce such works of our own. We share, discuss, question and try to understand them.

An important question from sister bint e aisha
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I think more important question is HOW you celebrate mawlid? 

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#8 [Permalink] Posted on 14th October 2021 08:06
Salaam111 wrote:
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Salaam.

It seems that you are not just enquiring, but you also have a bias towards celebrating mawlid. So can you please give me details if the first three generations of Muslims celebrated mawlid, and if you can't then can you give details of how and when mawlid started.

I am not asking to start a debate. I have many friends who celebrate mawlid so I would like to understand yours/their stance on this matter.
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#9 [Permalink] Posted on 14th October 2021 10:21
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#10 [Permalink] Posted on 14th October 2021 10:25
Meelad

1. Meelad started approximately 600 years after the Prophet (SAW) passed away. So it never took place in the time of the Prophet (SAW) or the Sahabas (RA).

2. For every occasion, we have been ordered by the Prophet (SAW) on how to celebrate, Eg.on Friday, wake up early, wear best clothes, etc. Same for Eid, Hajj, etc. But for Meelad there are no instructions in Shariah.

3. The only Hadith we do find is that the Prophet (SAW) said, "I fast on Monday because I was born on Monday."
So IF something IS allowed it would be ONLY fasting and this Hadith is for EVERY Monday, not only once a year. If we say it's for once a year, then what do we do when 12th Rabi-Ul-Awwal doesn't fall on a Monday?

4. There is Ikhtilaf in the DOB of the Prophet (SAW) but there is no Ikhtilaf that the Prophet (SAW) did pass away on the 12th. So should we be celebrating or not?

5. The best way to show love is to practice on the Sunnats of the Prophet (SAW).

6. Nowadays everyone can prove anything they want, so let's say for argument's sake, that to celebrate Meelad is allowed. Why? Because we have to show love for the Prophet (SAW), then why not do the same for approximately 124 000 Prophets and 124 000 Sahabas?
BECAUSE TO SHOW LOVE FOR THEM IS ALSO PART OF IMAN.

7. Some say it's Bid'at Hasana (good innovation) so why isn't it allowed?
At the end of Salaah we say Assalamualaikum-waraatullah, how about adding Wabarakaatuh? Because it's a beautiful word with a beautiful meaning and call it a good innovation, also it's not even prohibited in Quran and Hadith, so it should be allowed, no?!

8. Some say, "Why do you use cars, isn't that Bid'ah?"
Ans - We don't think of cars as part of Deen. If a person doesn't use a car, we wouldn't taunt him.

9. Some say, "What's wrong in praising the Prophet (SAW) and reading Durood on this day?"
Ans - Well, this, Alhamdulillah we do everyday by doing Taleem and we urge everyone to do so, NOT wait for 12th Rabi-ul-Awwal.

10. Some say, "Prove it from Qur'an and Hadith that it's not allowed."
Ans - On this principle, a lot of things can be allowed, eg. between Adhan and Iqamah, why not chant 'Ya Allah' 3x in a gathering? It's not forbidden in Qur'an and Hadith!

11. Some quote that Imam Suyuti (RA) said it's allowed.
Well, did he say, you should march the streets waving flags, chanting Durood and those who don't are Wahabees and sinful?

12. Also, did the 4 great Imams celebrate or not?
If not, why not?
If they did, how did they?

13. Marching the streets, waving flags and chanting Durood is DEFINITELY NOT FARADH, SUNNAH OR MUSTAHAB. If it is, prove it from Qur'an, Hadith and the life of Sahaba.

14. Prove from only Qur'an, Hadith and the life of Sahaba that it's allowed to march the streets, illuminate houses and sing Durood in a gathering on the 12th of Rabi-ul-Awwal.

Maulana Habeel Makda
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#11 [Permalink] Posted on 14th October 2021 10:56
The position of the Deobandi Ulama is that, not only is it permissible to have a “gathering” of Mawlid, rather it is an act of great virtue, as long as the gathering is free from the unlawful or reprehensible activities, such as free intermingling of the sexes, excessive wasteful spending, fixing of a particular date, etc, and it is not held to be something necessary to do such that those who choose not to participate are considered to be in the wrong.

The above is the Deobandi viewpoint and it would be inappropriate to force it upon them that they totally reject having “gatherings” of Mawlid. As mentioned earlier, it is wrong to force upon others their beliefs and opinions; rather we should take what they say at face value. The fundamental book that explains the viewpoints of the Deobandi Ulama is al-Muhannad ala al-Mufannad compiled by Shaykh Mawlana Khalil Ahmad al-Saharanpuri and endorsed by many scholars, such as Hakim al-Umma Shaykh Mawlana Ashraf Ali al-Tahanawi, Shaykh al-Hind Mawlana Mahmud al-Hasan Deobandi and many others (Allah have mercy on them all). The abovementioned viewpoint can be seen quite clearly in this book.

Shaykh Khalil Ahmad (a student of Shaykh Rashid Ahmad Gangohi) states:

“Far be it from any Muslim that he says (let alone us), mentioning the birth of the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace), or even mentioning the soil under his footwear and the urine of his donkey, is an act of reprehensible and unlawful innovation. Thus, aspects that have even a minute connection with the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace), mentioning them is from the much-loved of practices and from the greatest of recommendations, be it the mention of his blessed birth, or the mention of him relieving himself, standing, sitting, sleeping and being awake. This has been explained in detail in my book al-Barahin al-Qati’a in many places.” (al-Muhannad, P: 78)

The above text quite categorically states the permissibility of having a “gathering” of Mawlid. However, what the Deobandi Ulama reject is the unlawful and evil practices that have found their way into some Mawlid celebrations, especially in the Subcontinent. Thus, Shaykh Khalil Ahmad (Allah have mercy on him) further states:

“It is clear from the above that we do not reject the mentioning of the Messenger of Allah’s (Allah bless him him & give him peace) birth; rather, we reject and refute those evils that are attached to such gatherings as you may have seen them in the Indian subcontinent, such as mentioning fabricated and false narrations, intermingling of the sexes, excessive wasteful spending with lights and decorations, holding it to be something necessary to do such that those who choose not to participate are slandered and called non-believers, and other evils from which very few gatherings (in the subcontinent) are free. However, if the gathering is free from such evils, far be it from us that we say, mentioning the birth of the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace) is an evil and innovation…” (ibid, P: 80)

Let us now look at the Fatwa of Shaykh Mufti Muhammad Taqi Usmani (may Allah preserve him); with which some people have a problem. The respected Shaykh states:

“As I explained in my article on celebration of Eid-e-Milad-un-Nabi (Mawlid), holding a meeting to discuss different aspects of the life of the Holy Prophet (Allah bless him & give him peace) is a very meritorious act for which the Muslims should strive to the best of their ability. But confining this discussion to the events of the birth of the Holy Prophet and restricting it to a particular date and holding attendance at such meetings as necessary or obligatory for every Muslim renders this practice as bid’ah or innovation. Mostly the meetings of Mawlid today are of this type. Therefore, contemporary Ulema of Deoband have declared it a bid’ah. If the life of the Holy Prophet is made subject of a meeting, and the meeting is free of the above mentioned defects, nobody can call it a bid’ah. It is in this context that some scholars of the past have allowed the practice.” (Taken from the Al-Balagh website)

The upshot of the above Fatwa is that there are three things which are disapproved of:

1) Mentioning only the birth-events of the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace) in such gatherings,

2) Restricting the Mawlid gathering to a particular date,

3) Thinking it to be obligatory and binding upon everybody,

As such, if the above three main evils were avoided, not only will having a gathering of Mawlid be permissible; rather, it will be an act of great virtue.

I myself once asked Shaykh Taqi Usmani (may Allah preserve him) that if the evils were avoided in such gatherings, would they be permitted? He replied in the affirmative and said the most important of these evils that must be avoided is restricting the gathering to a particular date. This is quite significant, because during my stay in Syria, I observed Mawlid gatherings being conducted on many different dates of Rabi’ al-Awwal. So much so that many gatherings would even take place outside of this month. These gatherings would be spread out right through the year, although they would become more widespread in the month of Rabi’ al-Awwal.

In light of Shaykh Taqi Usmani’s words, these gatherings and meetings are not only permitted, rather highly recommended practices. It would be wrong (and an innovation) to specifically restrict the Mawlid gathering to the 12th of Rabi’ al-Awwal in a way that it would not take place on any other date.

Below is another Fatwa authorized by Mufti Taqi Usmani (may Allah preserve him):

“The gatherings arranged to remember the birth of the Prophet Muhammad, Sallallahu alayhi wasallam, the mercy to the mankind, are called Milad gatherings. Remembering the life of the Prophet Sallallahu alayhi wasallam, and teaching others about it, is an act of great blessing and virtue. However all good deeds have to be performed according to the rules and guidelines established by the Shariah. To exceed them is a grave sin. For example reciting the Qur’an is a great act of virtue, but it is prohibited to do so while one is in ruku or sujud in prayers. Likewise, Salat is one of the most important acts of worship. Yet, it is haram to perform it at sunrise or sunset.

Similarly, there are rules governing the blessed remembrance of the Sirah. For example, this remembrance must not be associated with a particular day or month; it should be considered equally virtuous during every month of the year, every week of the month, and every day of the week. Also it can take any permissible form. For example you can arrange a reading of an authentic book on Sirah or have a lecture delivered by a scholar. Doing that is not only permissible but it will bring great reward. But it is important to stay away from the evils found in the prevalent Milad gatherings. Here are some of those evils:

1) A particular date (12 of Rabi al-Awwal) has been designated for this remembrance,

2) The element of show-off (riya) is commonly present in these gatherings,

3) If someone does not attend these gatherings, he is looked down upon,

4) Distribution of sweets is considered an indispensable part of the proceedings,

5) To meet the expenses, donations are collected from sometimes unwilling people who give money under social pressure. According to the hadith it is not permissible to take any Muslim’s money without his willingness.

6) Intermixing of men and women commonly takes place in these gatherings. People stay late at night in these meetings thereby missing the next morning’s prayers.

7) The focus of the talks delivered there is very limited. The Prophet, Sallallahu alayhi wasallam, has given guidance for every aspect of our life. These cover acts of worship, dealing with other people, morals and manners, social relationships, business dealings, etc. However, it has been observed that the prevalent Milad talks concentrate mainly or solely on the account of the birth of the Prophet, Sallallahu alayhi wasallam, and his miracles. They do not attempt to cover the vast teachings of the Prophet, Sallallahu alayhi wasallam.

For these reasons, one should refrain from the prevalent Milad gatherings. However, if care is taken to avoid all of these evils and to follow the Shariah carefully, then a meeting organized to remember the Prophet, Sallallahu alayhi wasallam , with the sole purpose of seeking Allah’s pleasure, will Insha-Allah be a blessed event. And Allah knows best. (End of Fatwa)

Written: Muhammad Abdul Muntaqim Sylheti (Darul-Ifta, Darul-uloom Karachi) Concurrence from:

Justice Mufti Muhammad Taqi Usmani

Mufti Muhammad Rafi Usmani

Mufti Abdul Rauf Sakkharvi

And many others. (Source: www.albalagh.net)

The above Fatwa of Darul Uloom Karachi and approved by Shaykh Mufti Taqi Usmani (may Allah preserve him) also gives the same message, in that a Mawlid event or gathering, if free of impermissible matters, cannot be considered blameworthy or an innovation.

In my personal view (and Allah knows best), it is only a difference of interpretation and the way one puts forth his viewpoint. It is a case of what we discussed earlier that one says something and much more is added to it. If we were to look at the same above Fatwa endorsed by Mufti Taqi Usmani and turn it around, the message would seem quite the opposite. There are two ways of putting your argument forward.

For example: One can say that a gathering of Mawlid is a great act of virtue, a highly praiseworthy practice, etc….Then conclude the Fatwa or article by saying: However, if there are evils attached to the gathering, it would not be permitted. On the other hand, one may say that gatherings of Mawlid are wrong, an innovation, has too many evils, etc….Then conclude the answer by saying: However, if these evils were avoided it would be permissible.

Now, even though these two arguments give the same message, the assumption made is quite the opposite. It’s just a case of “how you say it”.

It is related that the great Deobandi scholar of Hadith, Fiqh and Tasawwuf, Shaykh Mawlana Rashid Ahmad Gangohi (Allah have mercy on him) once on his journey to Makkah al-Mukarrama for Umra visited his Shaykh and spiritual master, Haji Imdad Allah Muhajir al-Makki (Allah have mercy on him). Incidentally, on one of the days a Mawlid gathering was organized. His Shaykh Haji Imdad Allah (Allah have mercy on him) said to Shaykh Gangohi that there is a Mawlid gathering organized, would you like to attend with me? He refused and said: “How can I attend a gathering of Mawlid when I prevent others from attending it in India due the evils that have been attached to it. If they (people in India) came to know of me attending a Mawlid what would they say? Upon hearing this, his Shaykh Haji Imdad Allah said: “May Allah reward you. I would have not been happier if you attended the Mawlid than I am in you refusing to come with us, because you are steadfast on what you believe to be the truth.

Thereafter, Haji Imdad Allah al-Makki attended the Mawlid and one of the servants and students of Shaykh Mawlana Rashid Ahmad Gangohi, without informing his Shaykh, also went with him. This student of Shaykh Rashid Ahmad said after attending the Mawlid: “Had my Shaykh, Mawlana Rashid Ahmad Gangohi, attended the Mawlid gathering, he would have not condemned it, for it was free from evil and impermissible matters. (See: Malfuzat of Mufti Mahmud al-Hasan Gangohi, 1/99)

The Deobandis also have gatherings in which they mention the Sirah, characteristics and ways of the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace). Songs and Anashid in praise of the best of creation are sung. These gatherings are organized throughout the year and become more common in the month of Rabi’ al-Awwal. However, they do not attach it to a particular date, and also, rather than calling them “Mawlid” gatherings they call them “Sirah” gatherings, denoting that not only the birth of the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace) will be discussed rather his life in general. As such, no Deobandi can deny the permissibility and virtue of holding a meeting discussing the various aspects of the Messenger of Allah’s (Allah bless him & give him peace) life and songs and Anashid being sung. Deobandis themselves have such gatherings and call them Sirah gatherings/events. However, many others (non-Deobandis) have similar gatherings but they term them to be gatherings of Mawlid. Hence, judgments should not be based on the terminologies used, but rather on the concepts.

Therefore, we can conclude the Deobandi viewpoint on the Mawlid saying that it is a highly praiseworthy act for which one will be rewarded Insha Allah. However, it will be wrong and an innovation to attach the impermissible matters to it, and this is how they understand the statements of scholars such as Hafidh Ibn Hajar al-Asqalani, Imam Suyuti and others (Allah have mercy on them all) who permitted the Mawlid.

By looking into the books of the Deobandi Ulama, we can sum up these evils and impermissible practices in the following:

1) A particular date (i.e. 12th of Rabi’ al-Awwal) is fixed,

2) Only the birth-events of the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace) are discussed,

3) It is called a day of Eid, whilst Islam has only prescribed two Eids,

4) Celebrating the Mawlid is considered to be necessary,

5) Unlawful practices (such as intermingling of the sexes) take place,

On the other hand, if we were to look at the statements of those (non-Deobandi Ulama) who support the Mawlid, it becomes clear that they also strongly condemn the various evils mentioned by the Deobandi scholars.

The great Sufi and Maliki scholar residing in Makkah al-Mukarramah, Sayyid Muhammad ibn Alawi al-Maliki (may Allah have mercy on him) states in his short treatise regarding the Mawlid, Hawl al-ihtifal bi zikra mawlid al-nabawi al-sharif:

“How many times have we stressed that the Messenger of Allah’s day of birth is not considered a Eid, neither do we regard it as a day of Eid, for it is a day greater and more virtuous than the day of Eid. Eid only comes once a year, whilst celebrating the birth of the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace) and mentioning his Sirah should be a constant thing, without restricting it to a particular time or place.” (P.8-9)

He further sates:

“We celebrate the birth of the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace) constantly and all the time, at every occasion and at every event of happiness and joy. This is increased in the month of his birth “Rabi’ al-Awwal” and the day of his birth, Monday”. (p. 11)

He also states:

“One of the innovations (bid’a) of the Mawlid is that, it is practiced by some of those who celebrate it by carrying out unlawful activities, being negligent with prayers, involvement in Riba and not implementing the outward and inward Sunnas of the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace).” (p. 49)

And:

“One of the innovations that is practised in some countries is restricting the mention of the Messenger of Allah’s (Allah bless him & give him peace) sirah, characteristics, and praise, feeding others and carrying out other commendable actions to the month of Rabi’ al-Awwal because of the birth of the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace). However, it is necessary that these acts are not restricted to the month of Rabi’ only; rather, it is necessary (wajib) upon a Muslim that he carries out these good deeds constantly in every day of the month, for the mention of the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace) is not attached to a particular time….” (p. 50)

And:

“ If we met and mentioned the praises of the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace), his struggles, his characteristics and did not even mention the story of his birth, to which people have become accustomed to such an extent that they consider a Mawlid gathering incomplete without it….,we would have celebrated the Mawlid.” (p. 40)

When we study the above quotes of Shaykh Muhammad ibn Alawi al-Maliki (may Allah have mercy on him) taken from his book which he compiled in support of the Mawlid, it becomes clear that there is agreement between what the scholars of Deoband say and those who celebrate Malwid regarding the evil and unlawful practices. As such, there is no disagreement in reality.

daruliftaa.com/aqidah-belief/why-do-some-sunni-ulema-like...
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#12 [Permalink] Posted on 14th October 2021 11:11
I live 5 doors away from a huge Barelwi Masjid.

They had a march for the milad recently. SO MANY attendees stayed outside before Salah, during adhan on loud speakers and after Salah.

It seems they are exempt from Salah during Milaads due to their extreme love. When will Deobandi's ever reach this lofty status ;)

Facepalm!
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#13 [Permalink] Posted on 14th October 2021 11:48
Celebrating the mawlid: is the issue as clear cut as it seems?
Shaykh Yasir Qadhi

youtu.be/87I2-Si728U
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#14 [Permalink] Posted on 14th October 2021 12:01
bint e aisha wrote:
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Well Shaykh Yasir, Salah is dropped in happiness whilst engaging in this newly invented matter.
2 negatives only make a positive in Maths ;)

The Ulama who practice the Mawlid do not engage in these additional bidaat and dropping of Salah, or even fireworks! They do so within the limits of Shariah with evidence. They don't make up Hadith to prove themselves correct.
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#15 [Permalink] Posted on 14th October 2021 12:12
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