Alcohol confusion and consumption

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#1 [Permalink] Posted on 20th May 2020 10:22

Anonymous wrote:

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Just wanted to bring few facts to everyone's attention:

"Al-Keemiya" OR Chemistry was actually invented by Muslims.
"Al-Kohl" OR Alcohol was actually researched by Muslims.
Muslims and (their) scientists have known about "Alcohol" as an organic compound for at least 800 years.
Abu Yūsuf Yaʻqūb ibn ʼIsḥāq aṣ-Ṣabbāḥ al-Kindī [800-874 AD] wrote about "Alcohol usage in Perfume" in Kitab al-Taraffuq fi al-'itr: www.academia.edu/4170355/Kitab_Kimiya_al-itr_Book_of_the_...

Muslim Ulama have known about its usage in perfume and other things for a very long time.

Maybe "some people" are ignorant about Alcohol (in the Organic Chemistry sense) for the past 1,000 years but burden of ignorance of certain individuals should not be placed upon the Ummah or the Ulamah

Summary for non-Chemists: Next time when you are at a Petrol Station (or Gas Station), notice that your Gasoline contains Ethanol (Alcohol) and you will D-I-E if you drink it, forget about Halal or Haram issue. Alcohol has many types and the Hanafi Madhab has long understood and classified it (over 1200+ years ago) since it was common knowledge to Muslim scientists and Ulama.

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#2 [Permalink] Posted on 21st May 2020 11:49

What people need to be aware of is that Abu Hanifa’s fatwa is that all alcohol not from dates and grapes is fine as long as you don't drink enough to get drunk. This is the fatwa taken by modern scholars today. Some scholars do add extra restrictions but that's from their own hat. The actual fatwa of Abu Hanifa being used today had no other restriction except not drinking enough to get drunk.

So when some scholars say that you can add vodka or cider to your cooking (eg. Mufti Ebrahim Desai) then it's completely fine according to original fatwa of Hanafi.

There's a extreme minority of scholars (both deobandi and barelwi) however who say however that the mufta bihi is same as other 3 mazhabs ie adding even a tiny amount of vodka or any other alcohol for flavouring reasons makes food very impure and haram.

They say that there's plenty of food out there without alcohol so there's no daroorat (severe need) to take Abu Hanifa's fatwa. To be fair to this minority most of the food that does get added alcohol for flavouring reasons (carriers) are processed junk and there's plenty of good food out there with no added alcohol flavourings. So i can see why they say that there's no daroorat to adopt the marjooh (overidden) fatwa of Abu Hanifa.

But definitely the original fatwa of Abu Hanafi which is used by majority today is that all food with any amount of alcohol (not dates or grapes) is fine as long as you don't have enough to get drunk. Some early Hanafis did add extra restrictions like good intention (eg to get extra energy for ibadah) before drinking is necessary but those again were later additions to the actual fatwa of Abu Hanifa.

So before anyone criticises any scholar who says you can drink small amounts of vodka or add some to cooking for example then they should understand they're criticizing the use of Abu Hanifa's fatwa.

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#3 [Permalink] Posted on 21st May 2020 12:00

Claim

Quote:

So when some scholars say that you can add vodka or cider to your cooking (eg. Mufti Ebrahim Desai) then it's completely fine according to original fatwa of Hanafi.

False!

askimam.org/public/question_detail/16699

Those products which have the capability to intoxicate will also be unlawful, even if a small amount of consumption does not intoxicate the consumer.

And Allah Ta'ala Knows Best

Ml. Ehzaz Ajmeri,
Student Darul Iftaa

Checked and Approved by:

Mufti Ebrahim Desai

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#4 [Permalink] Posted on 21st May 2020 12:39

Here is one of many fatwas of scholars today which is based on Abu Hanifa. The conditions below are extra but not from original fatwa of Abu Hanifa. Even with these extra conditions he adds from his own hat he clearly says it's halal:

Question

1. Is it possible to use alcohol which is not made from grapes or dates or synthetic flavouring (eg champagne) for cooking purposes.?

2. What is the amount / percentage of alcohol that is found in food (eg soy sauce) that would make its consumption permissible and how do we calculate this?

Answer

In the name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful

Assalaamu `alaykum waRahmatullahi Wabarakatuh

1.   It is permissible to use alcohol which is not derived from grapes or dates with the following conditions:

It is not used as an intoxicant or to an amount which intoxicates. It is not used in vain

2. The permissibility and impermissibility will differ from person to person as each person’s level to bear the alcohol without getting intoxicated differs. One should avoid using excessive amounts of Alcohol in cooking if there is a doubt of it intoxicating. If there are alternatives available, then they should be adopted to avoid the chances of alcohol leading to intoxication.

And Allah knows best

Ml. Ehzaz Ajmeri,

Checked and Approved by:

Mufti Ebrahim Desai

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#5 [Permalink] Posted on 21st May 2020 12:47

Another one below makes Abu Hanifa’s view very clear. Only glass before getting drunk is haram otherwise all other glasses before are fine. This is the fatwa used by vast majority of modern scholars today

QUESTION

I have heard from somebody that he was of the opinion that the first grass is not haraam, but the glass before you become intoxicated with is. Is there any truth to this statement or is it taken out of context etc. if so what is the original statement and how is it interpretated?

Answer

The information is incorrect.

According to Imaam Abu Hanifa, alcohol from grapes or dates extract is absolutely prohibited. However, drinks extracted from wheat, barley, sugar cane, etc. is permissible to the extent that they do not intoxicate.
(Kawkabud Durri).

and Allah Ta’ala Knows Best

Mufti Ebrahim Desai
FATWA DEPT.

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#6 [Permalink] Posted on 21st May 2020 13:00

Muadh Khan said:

"Mufti Ebrahim Desai (HA) does not say that all"

Please look at fatwas above. There are more fatwas like this from him and also from many scholars today

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#7 [Permalink] Posted on 21st May 2020 13:51

Anonymous wrote:

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He has NEVER said that "Vodka" is permissible to add.

www.muftisays.com/forums/82-the-food-section/13381-bubble...

Ethanol ≠ Vodka

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#8 [Permalink] Posted on 21st May 2020 14:43

He clearly says:

"However, drinks extracted from wheat, barley, sugar cane, etc. is permissible to the extent that they do not intoxicate. (Kawkabud Durri)."

Vodka (many brands), cider, champagne etc all fall under that category.

The point being made is that all these fatwas are based on Abu Hanifa’s fatwa which says you can drink naturally brewed alcoholic drinks (not dates or grapes) as long you don’t get drunk:

QUESTION

I have heard from somebody that he was of the opinion that the first grass is not haraam, but the glass before you become intoxicated with is. Is there any truth to this statement or is it taken out of context etc. if so what is the original statement and how is it interpretated?

Answer

The information is incorrect.

So we need to bear in mind that this is the fatwa in use by majority today. Some today add some arbitrary conditions but that's from their own hat. The original fatwa of hanafi mazhab is very clear as confirmed in this fatwa.

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#9 [Permalink] Posted on 21st May 2020 15:04

SUMMARY

1. Abu Hanifa said you can drink any alcoholic beverages (not dates or grapes) up till the last glass before you get drunk. He did not add any other conditions. Some scholars added their own conditions later on (eg. not to drink in vain).

2. Hanafi mazhab thought Abu Hanifa's fatwa is too dangerous so they made it marjooh (overidden) and instead took Imam Muhammad's fatwa which is same as other 3 mazhabs. This became mufta bihi (the official ruling of hanafi).

3. Most modern scholars say there is daroorat (severe need - umoom balwa is one type used) to take fatwa of Abu Hanifa because there are many nice food items which add alcohol for flavouring purposes. Also many people like to add wine to cooking for nice flavour.

4. Extreme minority say that there is no daroorat (severe need) to put mufta bihi aside because there are plenty of good good available without any alcohol added for flavouring. Some of this minority even accuse the majority of opening doors for legalisation of alcoholic beverages.

5. Most people today say that majority is always correct in every issue so the correct opinion is that Abu Hanifa’s fatwa is the most appropriate for these times.

6. Extreme minority say that majority is not correct all the time and that in akhiruz zaman the majority will be wrong many times.

These are the 6 main points on this issue.

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#10 [Permalink] Posted on 21st May 2020 15:12

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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askimam.org/public/question_detail/16699

Those products which have the capability to intoxicate will also be unlawful, even if a small amount of consumption does not intoxicate the consumer.

And Allah Ta'ala Knows Best

Ml. Ehzaz Ajmeri,
Student Darul Iftaa

Checked and Approved by:

Mufti Ebrahim Desai

Request: Please summarise the text in RED in your own words.

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#11 [Permalink] Posted on 21st May 2020 16:55

askimam.org/public/question_detail/42921

According to that link the following ice cream is halal:

www.google.com/search?q=haagen+daz+rum+ice+cream&clie...

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mSiddiqui

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#12 [Permalink] Posted on 21st May 2020 17:03

So we can add Rum to our food but not Vodka?

Or are we only allowed to have rum when a non Muslim purchases it and adds it?

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#13 [Permalink] Posted on 21st May 2020 17:06

Are we allowed to drive a truck carrying cases of rum if it will be diluted to the point that only a few drops will go into the foods prepared by the company that is purchasing the rum?

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mSiddiqui

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#14 [Permalink] Posted on 21st May 2020 17:54

mSiddiqui wrote:

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mSiddiqui wrote:

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mSiddiqui wrote:

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Source of the Fatwa: askimam.org/public/question_detail/42921

Specific Fatwa: islamqa.org/hanafi/askimam/82998

Quote:

Vanilla extract, which contains alcohol, is used as an additive in foodstuffs. It will be halaal to consume such foodstuffs that contain the extract on condition the alcohol in producing the vanilla extract is not made from grapes or dates

Those who live in the real world and have ever eaten an ice cream may have some idea as to what Mufti Saheb (HA) is trying to say from the Madhab, otherwise Meh...

Thinking before Writing:

Fatwa isn't saying that consuming Vanillin Extract (with 35% Ethanol) at random is permissible
Fatwa is saying that food products which are made while using Vanillin Extract as an additive are permissible.

Anyone who has ever eaten a Donut (with Vanilla topping) or a Cake or an ice cream will know the difference between 1 & 2.

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#15 [Permalink] Posted on 22nd May 2020 02:44

Okay.

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mSiddiqui