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#226 [Permalink] Posted on 20th October 2011 09:54
Jazakallah for the reminder.

May be some cant read with understanding.

Khair. (since some dont like to open links, I have taken parts of it out here)


(by the way, its the work of scholars)

Shaykh ibn Baz رضي الله عنه has written in his Fatawa, "It is not permissible to wipe over thin socks...". (fatawa islamiyya pg102).



For reference for all four mazahib see text below from al fiqhul islami wa adilatuhu vol 1 pg 498:

قال ابو حنيفة لا يجوز المسح على الجوربين الا ان يكونا مجلدين او منعلين لان الجورب ليس معنى الخف لانه لا يمكن مواظبة المشى فيه الا اذا كانا منعلا وهو محمل الحديث المخبر للمسح على الجورب...الا انه رجع الى قول الصاحبين في اخر عمره...واشترط المالكية كابي حنيفة ان يكونا الجوربان مجلدين ظاهرهما وباطنهما حتى يمكن المشي فيهما عادة... واجاز الشافعية المسح على الجورب بشرطين احدهما ان يكون صفيقا لا يشف بحيث يمكن متابعة المشي عيله الثانى ان يكون منعلا فان اختل احد الشرطين لم

يجز المسح عليه... واباح الحنابلة المسح على الجورب بالشرطين المذكورين في الخف وهما الاول ان يكون صفيقا لا يبدو منه شئ من القدم الثانى ان يمكن متابعة المشى فيه...

Therefore, if you are a follower of any of the four mazaahib, it would be Haram for you to wipe over thin cotton socks. Any Salah preformed by wiping over thin socks will not be valid and that Salah will have to be repeated after washing the feet.

Then Pops along a new group who want to go against the 4 schols and start a 5th school. Proof of splitting from the Ahlus Sunnah wal Jama'

Quote taken from another post, but you have answered your very own misconception.

Abu Ahmad wrote:
Muadh_Khan wrote:
Perhaps he has a daleel for what he says and believes in?
everyone claims to have a daleel, it's not considered a daleel unless it's understood the same way it was understood by the salaf. Even the filthy Raafidah claim to have adillah!



The followers of the Salafi sect are the only people who consider masah on ordinary socks valid. (Apart from the Shia, but atleast they wipe the skin of the feet, even though it not valid). There only basis for this is the opinion Ibn Taymiyyah (rahmatullahi alaih):

In his Fataawa, Ibn Taimiyyah (rahmatullahi alaih) states:

"Masah on jurabain is permissible when one is able to walk in them, whether they are mujallad (covered with leather) or not is the most authentic view of the Ulama. And, in the Sunan: Verily Nabi (sallallahu alayhi wasallam) made masah on his jurabain and na'lain (shoes). And this Hadith even if it is not proven, qiyaas (logic) demands this (validity of masah) because the difference between jurabain and na 'lain is only this that the one is from wool and the other from leather. It is known that a difference of this nature has no effect in the Shariah. Hence, there is no difference between leather, cotton or woollen socks just as there is no difference between white and black ihram. At most, leather is more durable than wool. Thus this has no effect..." (Vol. 21 page 214)

Even Ibn Taimiyyah (rahmatullahi alaih) concedes that the Hadith narration pertaining to masah on jurabain is of questionable reliability. As such it is not valid to extend the Masah alal Khuffain ruling (effect) to jurabain. The law pertaining to Khuffain is the effect of Ahaadith-e- Mutawaatarah (Hadith narrations of the highest category, the authenticity of which is absolute). It is for this reason that we see that not a single one among the Aimmah-e-Mujtahideen and the Fuqaha of the four Math-habs claiming that masah on jurabain is valid.

While Ibn Taimiyyah has primarily resorted to logic, the authorities of the Shariah - the Aimmah-e-Mujtahideen and the Fuqaha - have acted purely on the Ahaadith of Rasulullah (sallallahu alayhi wasallam).
It is inconceivable that the Fuqaha of all Four Math-habs, from the earliest time of Islam, could have unanimously ruled in error that masah on ordinary socks is not permissible.
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#227 [Permalink] Posted on 20th October 2011 10:29

MashaAllaah!!
Comment on the adillah the brother used, paragraph by paragraph, the same way he refuted you.
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#228 [Permalink] Posted on 20th October 2011 10:29

"Abu Ahmad" wrote:
"Seifeddine-M" wrote:
"Ibn_Muhammed" wrote:
The great students of imam Abu Hanifa Rahimahullah, who helped spread the madhab in the majority, Abu Yusuf and Muhammed differed in about two thirds of the madhab. Are you going to call them 'Salafis' aswell now? Grow up bro.
[colour=black] Both Imams Abu Yusuf رضي الله عنه Muhammad رضي الله عنه were Mujtahids within the school. They were qualified and capable of extracting laws from the Qur'an and Sunnah themselves. This is far far far from the case with regards to the likes of us.
Please fear Allaah in your answers! Sheikh Abu Yusuf and Muhammed bin Hasan differed with Imam Abu Haneefah in the majority of his madhab, many of their opinions were the complete opposite to what Imam Abu Haneefah said, it's strange why the Ahnaaf don't criticize them but then choose to criticize everyone else. Remember akhi fillaah, we're not going to be asked about fullaans belief or 'allaans belief, on yawm al-qiyamah, everyone is for himself; Allaah says in surah 'Abasa; "That Day shall a man flee from his brother, And from his mother and his father, And from his wife and his children. Every man, that Day, will have enough to make him careless of others." (Surah 'Abasa : 34-37) I ask Allaah to protect us from the torment of the fire, and to allow us to be with each other in the highest Jannah alongside the Prophet (may the peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) and his companions.

 

May be you have not understood something. You have not read the links given in the earlier posts.

Yes they differed on some Masail, however from the shura of Ulama any Mas'ala they discussed, it was not written down in the books until EVERY single person accepted the verdict and agreed upon it.

http://www.abumohammed.muftisays.com/Top_40_Hanafi_Scholars.pdf

 

So if you want to go through every point that the great Imams differed upon in comparison to the 1.3MILLION Masail they and others agreed upon, then be my guest.

Imam Abu Bakr ibn Abi Shaibah tried to do it and he said he found 125 masa'il that could be questioned. From that 125, 60 of them were proven to be wrong, thats 65 that can be questioned. Even these 65 had been given evidence to back it up."

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#229 [Permalink] Posted on 20th October 2011 10:32

"Abu Ahmad" wrote:
MashaAllaah!! Comment on the adillah the brother used, paragraph by paragraph, the same way he refuted you.

Sorry brother, I am not a commentator on Hadith. I take from the Salaf (agreed upon) as they were reliable and sound.

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#230 [Permalink] Posted on 20th October 2011 10:32
abu mohammed wrote:


Abu Ahmad wrote:
Muadh_Khan wrote:
Perhaps he has a daleel for what he says and believes in?
everyone claims to have a daleel, it's not considered a daleel unless it's understood the same way it was understood by the salaf. Even the filthy Raafidah claim to have adillah!



Surely Sufyan Ath-Thawri was from the salaf... he was born 97 after hijrah, and died 161 after hijrah.
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#231 [Permalink] Posted on 20th October 2011 10:38

Allaahu Akbar, the things you come out with when trying to defend the hanafees

And of mankind are some who take (for worship) others besides Allh as rivals (to Allh). They love them as they love Allh. But those who believe, love Allh more (than anything else). If only, those who do wrong could see, when they will see the torment, that all power belongs to Allh and that Allh is Severe in punishment (surah Al-Baqarah: 165)


Even they way you lot try and defend Imam Abu Haneefah, the greatest muhaddithoon said he was weak in hadeeth, and you claim these Muhaddithoon followed their desire in that.

Allaahu Al-Musta'aan

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#232 [Permalink] Posted on 20th October 2011 10:44
SubhanAllah, an accusation on me of SHIRK and Slander on Imam Abu Hanifa.

Some of the Greatest Muhaddithoon was on the Fiqh of Imam Abu Hanifa.

You can not be a FAQIH with out being a MUHADDITH.

Brother Muadh has already refuted this allegation.

Why dont you people read the links.

Why are you trying so hard to get banned from this site. Although you are proving yourselves in a very good way, you are making it more apparent why this thread is called the Salafi Hijack.
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#233 [Permalink] Posted on 20th October 2011 10:59
abu mohammed wrote:
SubhanAllah, an accusation on me of SHIRK and Slander on Imam Abu Hanifa.

Some of the Greatest Muhaddithoon was on the Fiqh of Imam Abu Hanifa.

[/quote]

I don't think you know what 'daeef' is when it comes to a raawi. Go study some mustalaah then come back.


abu mohammed wrote:


Why dont you people read the links.

[/quote]

I read the refutation, was very funny mashaAllaah.


[quote="abu mohammed"]

Brother Muadh has already refuted this allegation.



I think it'll be very beneficial if you post his whole refutation here, then when I quote from it, now one can accuse me of lying.


[quote="abu mohammed"]

Why are you trying so hard to get banned from this site.



Allaahu Akbar. Truth hurts!!



On the Day when their faces will be turned over in the Fire, they will say: "Oh, would that we had obeyed Allh and obeyed the Messenger (Muhammad )."
And they will say: "Our Lord! Verily, we obeyed our chiefs and our great ones, and they misled us from the (Right) Way.
(Surah Al-Ahzaab: 66,67)


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#234 [Permalink] Posted on 20th October 2011 11:30
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#235 [Permalink] Posted on 20th October 2011 13:21
Abu Ahmad wrote:
Surely Sufyan Ath-Thawri was from the salaf... he was born 97 after hijrah, and died 161 after hijrah.


As you mentioned the great Imam Sufyan ath-Thawri (rahmatullaahi alaih) thought you mind the following interesting:

He used to lecture in Kufa and his school of thought was followed till the fifth century. Imaam Shu'ba (A.R) and Imaam Yahya bin Ma'een (A.R) referred to him as "The Leader of the Mu'mineen in Hadith". Hadhrat Abdullaah bin Mubaarak, Yahya bin Sa'eed Qattaan and Wakee bin Jarraah (A.R) were amongst his students. He never raised his hands when proceeding for Ruku and when rising from Ruku. With regard to this act, Imaam Tirmidhi (A.R) writes, "Such was the practise of many men of knowledge from amongst the Sahaaba (RA) and the Taabi'een, as well as Sufyaan Thowri (A.R)." [Vol.1 Pg.35]

When such an eminent scholar did not raise his hands, it proves that the Sahaaba (RA) did not generally carry out this practice. He also stated that it is best to recite "Bismillah" silently during salaah. [Tadhkira] He was also of the opinion that the Taraaweeh Salaah consists of twenty rakaahs. Imaam Tirmidhi (A.R.) writes, "Most men of knowledge are in agreement with what has been narrated from Hadhrat Ali (RA), Hadhrat Umar (RA) and other companions of Rasulullaah (sallAllaahu-alayhi-wa-sallam) i.e. that Taraaweeh should be twenty rakaahs. This is also the opinion of Imaam Sufyaan Thowri (A.R). [Vol.1 Pg.79]


http://www.muftisays.com/blog/Seifeddine-M/570_16-11-2010/academic-background-of-imam-abu-haneefah-(rahmatullahi-alaih).html
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#236 [Permalink] Posted on 20th October 2011 14:08
Abu Ahmed wrote:
Comment on the adillah the brother used, paragraph by paragraph, the same way he refuted you.


What are you requesting here?
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#237 [Permalink] Posted on 21st October 2011 11:43
Abu Ahmad wrote:
Even they way you lot try and defend Imam Abu Haneefah, the greatest muhaddithoon said he was weak in hadeeth, and you claim these Muhaddithoon followed their desire in that.



Abu Nuaym narrates in his Hiyat al Awliya, Bukhari and Muslim narrate from another Sanad from Abu Hurayrah (Allah be pleased with him), Abu Bakr Shirazi narrates in his Kitab Alqab, Tabarani from Sa'd bin Ubaidah (Allah be pleased with him) and Ibn Masud (Allah be pleased with him) that the Prophet (Allah Bless him and grant him peace) said:
---If Ilm was suspended from Pleiades (The furthest Star) and the Arabs are unable to reach it, then a man from the sons of Persia will be able to reach it.


Imam Suyuti mentions that the Ulema have stated that that these hadith are in favor of Imam Abu Hanifa and are authentic.



An Eye Witness

Ash- Sha'raani, a famous scholar of the past, said, "Allah blessed me that I looked at three Masaanid (collections of Hadith) of Al-Imam Abu Haneefa from a correct copy. Upon these were the khutoot of Al-Huffaath, (meaning the writing of the Muhadditheen) and I saw that Imam Abu Hanifa does not narrate except from the best of the Tabi'een, who are 'Udool (people with honorable records) and Thiqat (reliable sources). And they (the Tabi'een) are from the best of the all generations (Khairul Quroon) like Al-Aswad, Alqama, Ataa, Ikrima, Mujahid, Makhool, Al-Hasan al Basri, and others like them. Every narrator between Al-Imam and between the Messenger of Allah (SAW) are 'Udool, Thiqat, A'laam (extremely knowledgeable).
SubhanAllah

Yahya Ibn Ma'een (RA) mentions from his teacher Yahya Ibn Sa'eed Al-Qattaan (RA) that he said, We have not heard better opinions than Abu Hanifa's. And we take most of his opinions.

The Imam of Al-Jarh and At-Ta'deel (The knowledge of what was transmitted concerning the reliability of the individual narrators of Hadith) Yahya Ibn Sa'eed Al-Qattaan also said that By Allah, Imam Abu Hanifa is the most knowledgeable person of this Ummah of what has come from Allah and his Messenger (SAW).
AllahuAkbar, What a statement from a scholar of such calibre


Yahya Ibn Sa'eed Al-Qattaan is not only a great Muhaddith of the past, but he is one of the first Imaams in regards to the science of Al-Jarh and At-Ta'deel. His opinions are taken by all the scholars in regards to narrators of Hadith.
SubhanAllah, All the Scholars of Hadith take advice from him, Yet...

There are those who reject Imam Abu Hanifa and accuse him of being Weak.

SubhanAllah



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#238 [Permalink] Posted on 21st October 2011 11:45
Yahya Ibn Ma'een, said that Wakee ibn Al-Jarraah used to give fatwa on the opinions of Abu Hanifa and he used to remember all the Hadith from Abu Haneefa. And he himself heard many Hadith from Abu Haneefa. We know that Yahya ibn Ma'een and Wakee Ibn Al-Jarraah are both from the great Muhadditheen, and Wakee ibn Al- Jarraah is the teacher of Imam Ash-Shafi'i, and his giving fatwa on Imam Abu Hanifa's fataawa and remembering Al-Imam's Hadith, all of these also indicate towards Imam Abu Hanifa's high level in Hadith.
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#239 [Permalink] Posted on 21st October 2011 11:46
Yahya ibn Ma'een says that Yahya ibn Said al Qattan said:
By Allah! We sat in the company of Abu Hanifa and heard many religious issues from him. I swear by Allah! When I looked at his face I used to be overcome with firm conviction that this man is very fearful of Allah.
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#240 [Permalink] Posted on 21st October 2011 11:46
Muhammad ibn Ayman narrates that when Abdullah ibn Mubarak was asked about Imam Abu Hanifa he replied:
Can anyone ever be like him? He was tried with lashes but he exercised forbearance.
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