Argument 9: Why is it that Tassawuff people engage in Loud Dhik’r when we know that Sahaba (RA) disapproved of this practise and considered it Bi’dah and stopped people from it?
The entire refutation of Loud Dhik’r is based on a SINGLE INCIDENT of Sayyidina Abdullah Ibn Mas’ood (RA) and there is NO OTHER report in its refutation to the best of our knowledge.
Refutation by Sahaba (i.e. in plural is nothing but exaggeration).
Here is the Athar in Arabic.
أخبرنا الحكم بن المبارك، أخبرنا عمرو بن يحيى، قال سمعت أبي يحدث، عن ابيه، قال كنا نجلس على باب عبد الله بن مسعود قبل صلاة الغداة فإذا خرج مشينا معه إلى المسجد فجاءنا أبو موسى الأشعري فقال أخرج إليكم أبو عبد الرحمن بعد قلنا لا فجلس معنا حتى خرج فلما خرج قمنا إليه جميعا فقال له أبو موسى يا أبا عبد الرحمن إني رأيت في المسجد آنفا أمرا أنكرته ولم أر والحمد لله إلا خيرا قال فما هو فقال إن عشت فستراه قال رأيت في المسجد قوما حلقا جلوسا ينتظرون الصلاة في كل حلقة رجل وفي أيديهم حصى فيقول كبروا مائة فيكبرون مائة فيقول هللوا مائة فيهللون مائة ويقول سبحوا مائة فيسبحون مائة قال فماذا قلت لهم قال ما قلت لهم شيئا انتظار رأيك وانتظار أمرك قال أفلا أمرتهم أن يعدوا سيئاتهم وضمنت لهم أن لا يضيع من حسناتهم ثم مضى ومضينا معه حتى أتى حلقة من تلك الحلق فوقف عليهم فقال ما هذا الذي أراكم تصنعون قالوا يا أبا عبد الرحمن حصى نعد به التكبير والتهليل والتسبيح قال فعدوا سيئاتكم فأنا ضامن أن لا يضيع من حسناتكم شيء ويحكم يا أمة محمد ما أسرع هلكتكم هؤلاء صحابة نبيكم صلى الله عليه وسلم متوافرون وهذه ثيابه لم تبل وآنيته لم تكسر والذي نفسي بيده إنكم لعلى ملة هي أهدى من ملة محمد أو مفتتحو باب ضلالة قالوا والله يا أبا عبد الرحمن ما أردنا إلا الخير قال وكم من مريد للخير لن يصيبه إن رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم حدثنا أن قوما يقرءون القرآن لا يجاوز تراقيهم وايم الله ما أدري لعل أكثرهم منكم ثم تولى عنهم
And the English translation:
From Amr Ibn Salamah: We used to sit at the door of Abdullaah Ibn Masood before the Morning Prayer, so that when he came out, we would be able to walk with him to the mosque. So Abo Mosa al-Asharee came to us, so he said, Has Abo Abdur-Rahmaan come out yet?So we said, No.So he sat with us until he came out. So when he came out, all of us stood up with him. So Abo Mosa said to him, O Abaa Abdur-Rahmaan, verily I saw in the mosque a detestable action that I hated but I did not see and the praise is for Allaah anything except good. He said, So what was it?He said, If you live, you will see it. I saw in the mosque, a people sitting in circles, waiting for the Prayer. There was a man in every circle, and in their hands were pebbles, so he would say: So Allahu Akbar (Allah is Greater) one hundred times, so they would say it one hundred times. So he would say: Say al-hamdulillah (the praise is for Allah) one hundred times,so they would say it one hundred times. And he would say: Say subhanallah (Free is Allah from all imperfection) one hundred times,so they would say it one hundred times. He said, So what did you say to them? He said, I did not say to them anything, I waited for your command.He said, Would that you had ordered them to count up their evil deeds, and assured them that nothing from their evil deeds would be lost!Then he went, and we went with him, until he came upon the circles of these people. So he stood over them and said, What is this that I see you doing?! They said, O Abaa Abdur-Rahmaan, these are pebbles upon which we count the takbeer, tahleel, and tasbeeh. He said, Then count up your evil deeds, and I assure you that nothing from your evil deeds will be lost. Woe to you O Ummah of Muhammad! How quickly you rush to destruction! These are the Companions of your Prophet (sallallahu alayhi wa sallam) who are abundant. And these are his clothes that have not yet decayed, and his bowl that is still unbroken. By Him in Whose Hand my soul is, either you are upon the religion better guided than the Ummah of Muhammad, or you are opening the door to misguidance. They said, By Allah O Abaa Abdur-Rahmaan, we did not intend anything except good. He said, And how many people intend good yet do not achieve it? Verily the Messenger (sallallahu alayhi wa sallam) informed us: Verily there will be a people reciting the Quran, yet it will not pass beyond their throats. [1] By Allah I do not know, perhaps most of them are from amongst you. Then he left them. So Amr Ibn Salamah said: We saw the great majority of these people fight against us upon the day of an-Nahrawan along with the Khawarij.
First reply:
One of the chains of this Athar contains "Amr bin Yahya" in the chain and he is discarded by the Masters of Hadeeth, see below.
From Imam Dhahabis Mizan Al i'tidal (vol 3, #6474)
6474 - عمرو بن يحيى بن عمرو بن سلمة . قال يحيى بن معين : ليس حديثه بشئ . قد رأيته . وذكره ابن عدى مختصرا
- 'Amr bin Yahya bin 'Amr bin Salama. Ibn Ma'in said: "His hadith are nothing"....
From Imam Dhahabi in his Mughni al Dhuafa (#4728)
4728 - عمرو بن يحيى بن عمارة شيخ مالك وثقوه وقال ابن معين ليس بقوي
Shaykh al Islam Ibn Hajar 'Asqalani in his Lisan Al Mizan (Vol 4, #1128):
[ 1128 ] عمرو بن يحيى بن عمرو بن سلمة قال يحيى بن معين ليس حديثه بشيء قد رأيته وذكره بن عدي مختصرا انتهى وقال بن خراش ليس بمرضي وقال بن عدي ليس له كبير شيء ولم يحضرني له شيء
- 'Amr bin Yahya bin 'Amr bin Salama. Yahya bin Ma'in said, "His hadith are nothing"(same as Dhahabi". Ibn Khurash said, "He is not accepted."
Second reply:
We do understand that this same incident is narrated through another chain which is “Hasan Ley-Ghairihi” and in that case it contradicts with the solid and sound statement of a student of Sayyidina Abdullah Ibn Mas’ood (RA) i.e. Shaqiq Ibn Abi Wail (RA) who reports that if a report comes to you that Sayyidina Abdullah Ibn Mas’ood (RA) prohibited Dhik’r in a Majlis then reject it and here it is from Musnad of Imam Ahmed (RA):
ما في كتاب الزهد لأحمد عن شفيق بن أبي وائل قال هؤلاء الذين يزعمون أن عبد الله كان ينهى عن الذكر ما جالسته مجلساً قط إلا ذكر الله فيه،
And here is affirmation of Shaqiq Ibn Abi Wail (RA) (the narrator) by none other then Ibn Hajar (RA):
Third reply:
Lastly, despite being problematic in its chain and conflicting in its text this Athar of Sayyidina Abdullah Ibn Mas’ood (RA) about prohibition of Loud Dhik’r also conflicts with many other Ahadeeth of Rasul-ullah (Sallaho Alaihe Wassalla) were loud Dhik’r is mentioned e.g:
Abu Huraira reported Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying that Allah, the Exalted and Glorious, thus stated: I am near to the thought of My servant as he thinks about Me, and I am with him as he remembers Me. And if he remembers Me in his heart, I also remember him in My Heart, and if he remembers Me in assembly I remember him in assembly, better than his (remembrance), and if he draws near Me by the span of a palm, I draw near him by the cubit, and if he draws near Me by the cubit I draw near him by the space (covered by) two hands. And if he walks towards Me, I rush towards him
Scholars have written many books detailing the narrations in which loud Dhik'r is mentioned so this 1 "conlicting" report from a Sahaba CANNOT be taken at face value.
Jazakullah Khaiurn