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Archbishop of Canterbury threatened by MPs over gay marriage

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#1 [Permalink] Posted on 13th February 2023 16:30
MPs threatened me over gay marriage, says Archbishop of Canterbury

Justin Welby said he was summoned twice to Parliament and threatened with parliamentary action to force same-sex marriage on the Church

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/02/12/mps-threatened-gay-ma...

Justin Welby warned that the church should not be ‘dictated to’, ‘blackmailed’ or ‘bribed’ over the issue CREDIT: Getty Images
The Archbishop of Canterbury claims he was “threatened with parliamentary action” in an attempt to “force same-sex marriage” in the Church of England....

twitter.com/freemonotheist/status/1625099038407249920?s=2...
Quote:
He later added: “Obedience to God comes ahead of loyalty to country. That was not popular when I said it, last Monday night, to some Members of Parliament.” If a Muslim had said that he would have been referred to Prevent!



In another article:
anglican.ink/2023/02/12/archbishop-of-canterbury-challeng...
CLAIMS by the Archbishop of Canterbury to global Anglican leaders in Ghana that he was “threatened with parliamentary action” to “force same-sex marriage” on the Established Church of England, have been challenged as “playing with the full truth!”

The Most Revd Justin Welby is currently speaking at the Anglican Consultative Council (ACC) meeting in Ghana, where over 110 representatives from over 40 Anglican provinces (national churches) are gathered. The significant event comes just days after the CofE’s General Synod voted to bring in prayers to ‘bless’ same sex unions and, to remove the ban on gay clergy in civil partnerships having to remain celibate.

In a Presidential Address, Mr Welby told those present in the Ghanian capital, Accra, that “I was summoned twice to Parliament, and threatened with parliamentary action to force same-sex marriage on us, called in England equal marriage. When I speak of the impact that actions by the Church of England will have on those abroad in the Anglican communion, those concerns are dismissed by many, not all, but by many.”

But the archbishops’ comments – to an audience representing provinces (national churches) which are vastly supportive of the traditional and biblical views of marriage and sexuality – have been roundly criticised by the leader of Anglican Orthodox, a grassroots movement of clergy and parish officers opposed to the Synod’s recent vote.

The Revd Paul Eddy is a vicar in Oxfordshire, Convenor of Anglican Orthodox, and the pubic relations adviser to the influential Global South Fellowship of Anglican Churches (GSFA) which publicly challenged the archbishop liberalising leadership at last year’s Lambeth Conference. The GSFA’s provinces represent around 75 percent of global Anglicans.

Mr Eddy said: “Sadly, as we found at the Lambeth Conference, the archbishop tells church leaders something which, in their culture, means something different to ours, knowing they don’t have independent advisers on hand to explain. The truth is ‘parliament’ does not mean the UK ‘government’, which is what Anglican Communion delegates, from 40-plus nations, just arrived in Ghana, will think.

“I’ve discussed these issues with MPs from both sides. There was an Urgent Debate in the Commons on the issue at which (from the BBC Parliament Channel), I counted 11 MP’s present. I think almost all of them gay, and several in gay civil partnerships. There were less than 30 MPs at any time in the chamber. With over 400 MPs, that’s hardly a ‘strong challenge from parliament.”

Mr Eddy, who has strong links with Christian MPs said he was also aware of two gay MPs canvassing support for a possible ‘Westminster Hall Debate. The motion would be to explore a Bill to remove the CofE’s equality law exemptions and, start the process towards the Disestablishment of the CofE.

Mr Eddy says MPs on both sides of the aisle told him their respective Party leadership has no interest in “starting a debate about the CofE, of which the King is the ‘supreme governor’, in his year of Coronation. Or, unsettling relations with other faiths in sensitive areas of the nation.”

Mr Eddy said: “If parliament were to try to take away the CofE’s exemptions under the 2010 Equality Act, it would mean the British Parliament would take away the historic ‘freedom of religion’ when, across the globe we criticise other Governments for persecuting people of faith. It wouldn’t stand up to legal challenge. It is nonsense and the archbishop knows it. Justin Welby is giving just enough information to make delegates think he had no alternative. But he is not telling them the whole truth.

“If this were true, why did he not say so in the House of Lords that he’d been threatened? Why did he not mention it to General Synod last week over the two days of debate last week?

“And why, when the Second Estates Commissioner – the official link between the CofE and the House of Commons – spoke in the General Synod debate, his assessment was, there are some MPs who wanted change, but many others had spoken to him privately, saying they were against any change, but were afraid to say so publicly. Why didn’t the archbishop tell the ACC that?”

Mr Eddy says the archbishop is also deliberately withholding from the ACC a very important and sensitive piece of information which “would render his claim nonsense”.

He said: “Let’s get real. Is he really saying Parliament would take away the Equality Act rights, and Freedom of Religion rights of Christians – including the Roman Catholics (backed by the Pope), and of Muslims, not to hold gay marriage in churches, synagogues or Mosques?

“Sorry. At a time when community relations between other faiths is both delicate and vital, the MPs I spoke to told me there was no way any political party would try to ‘impose’ gay marriage on Muslims, Jews, or people of any faith.”


Another source with additional input
www.gbnews.uk/news/archbishop-of-canterbury-says-mps-thre...

The Archbishop of Canterbury has said MPs threatened him with parliamentary action during their attempts to “force” same-sex marriage into the Church of England.

The Church of England’s legislative assembly, the General Synod, passed a motion to allow the blessing of same-sex couples in civil partnerships earlier this month.

There are concerns the results of the vote could draw up divisions between the Church of England and worldwide Anglican Communion.

The Most Rev Justin Welby said that he was summoned twice to Parliament over the issue, insisting that he refused to be “dictated to”, “blackmailed” or “bribed”.

Most Rev Justin Welby said that he was summoned twice to Parliament

He was speaking at his presidential address to the 18th plenary of the ACC and said “rules about sexuality in the Church of England” have been tabled for discussion as a “result” of growing atheism in the UK.

Addressing the threats, Welby said: “The result is clear.

“In the last few weeks, as part of our discussions about sexuality and the rules around sexuality in the Church of England,

“I talked of our interdependence with all Christians, not just Anglicans, particularly those in the global south with other faith majorities.

“As a result I was summoned twice to Parliament, and threatened with parliamentary action to force same-sex marriage on us, called in England equal marriage.

“When I speak of the impact that actions by the Church of England will have on those abroad in the Anglican communion.

“Those concerns are dismissed by many, not all, but by many in the General Synod.”

He continued: “Obedience to God comes ahead of loyalty to country.

Welby insisted: "Obedience to God comes ahead of loyalty to country."
Welby insisted: "Obedience to God comes ahead of loyalty to country." James Manning
“That was not popular when I said it, last Monday night, to some Members of Parliament.”

Welby said that in the Church of England, archbishops do not chair the General Synod or organise its debates.

“In the UK and in many parts of Europe the majority of people now belong to no faith at all,” he said.

“They are not Christians, they are not Muslims, they are not pagans, they are not Jews, they are not Hindus. They do not belong.”

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#2 [Permalink] Posted on 13th February 2023 16:42
In England, what is the ratio of legal marriages and "live-in Relationships"

When two men stay together, is that illegal in UK.

What benefits do they get by same sex marriage.
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#3 [Permalink] Posted on 13th February 2023 20:31
akbar703 wrote:
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When two men stay together, is that illegal in UK.

No.

What benefits do they get by same sex marriage.

Same benefits as normal (heterosexual) marriage
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#4 [Permalink] Posted on 13th February 2023 22:51
abu mohammed wrote:
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Muslims need to come out and support Christians and Jews who stand up against lgbt and stop having such a selfish isolationist approach. Christians are virtually all finished and totally liberalise so seeing him stand up against lgbt is actually surprising. Instead imams and Muslims.will just hide under rocks and tomorrow when imams are forced to accept gay marriage we'll have no leg to stand on
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#5 [Permalink] Posted on 14th February 2023 06:19
mkdon101 wrote:
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Imams can't change shariah.
They have no powers to change Haraam to Halal.

May be..... gays will approach a gay imam. Lol.
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#6 [Permalink] Posted on 14th February 2023 10:06
akbar703 wrote:
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It's not whether an imam can change sharia or not but they may legislate that nikah for gays can't be refused based on their sexuality. If a mosque offers nikah ceremony then they cannot refuse gays otherwise it'll be classed as discriminatory. We are far from it but it can happen one day.

Majority of mosques are not registered marriage ceremony venues meaning nikah conducted therein is not automatically registered for legal purposes but any change in law could first affect those mosques that are registered.
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#7 [Permalink] Posted on 14th February 2023 10:16
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If legislated. The Imams can say, in shariah, Nikah is between bride and groom, a man and woman. Who is the bride /woman here, we would like to take eijaab qabool with her. If he says, other party is gay, the qazi can say, nikah is between man and woman, bring a woman we shall perform nikah ceremony. Diplomatically we can handle it, here we are not rejecting gay marriage. Gay says "then we don't need nikah"...... welcome!!!

It is like a man in subcontinent insists on nikah with sister of living wife.... the imams handle it.
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#8 [Permalink] Posted on 14th February 2023 10:43
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Or the marriage declaration can be.

" As per the orders of haakim, Johnson and as per the shariah of johnson, Mr. X1 and Mr X2 I declare you both man and man, groom and groom... Do you accept Mr X2 as your man".

I accept....

Now...leave....
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