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Fatwa vs Taqwa

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#61 [Permalink] Posted on 29th March 2014 13:04

[QUOTE:73416:london786

Hazrat,

Therein lies the problem.

You can't claim to not know:

  1. You either KNOW
  2. OR you DON'T know

Fear of Allah (SWT) is central to a Muslims's Emaan and Allah (SWT) hearts. If you know that you are not supposed to have a girl friend and you on purpose go chasing a Fatwa which permits it its trying to (Astaghfirullah) Fool Allah (SWT).

Nothing to do with Fatwa vs Taqwa issue because you know that Fatwa is wrong so the question doesn't arise.
 

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#62 [Permalink] Posted on 29th March 2014 16:21
Taqwa is abstaining from sins and doing good deeds.

To listen to people of knowledge (mufti/alim), and follow there advice(fatwa), is infact a taqwa. Not listening to people of knowledge and not taking there advice is infact bad. And to think and find the answer of mufti to be not proper is also an act of arrogance.
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#63 [Permalink] Posted on 29th March 2014 17:56

I have read 5 pages and I have not come across two simple answers:

  1. How is acting on good, sound Fatwa NOT Taqwa?
  2. Where is the above written in which book of Fiqh and which saying of which Imam?
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#64 [Permalink] Posted on 29th March 2014 23:47
Muadh_Khan wrote:
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Your question assumes Fatwa and Taqwa are mutually exclusive.

One can be acting on a Fatwa and Taqwa at the same time.

One can be acting on a Fatwa, and NOT on Taqwa at the same time.

Therefore, your sensationalist question adds nothing to the discussion. Rather, you should read the 5 pages again - in fact read the Hadith which I posted earlier. The Hadith has made these categories:

1. Haram (maharim)
2. Shubuhat (doubtful)
3. Taqwa
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#65 [Permalink] Posted on 30th March 2014 00:57
So much confusion, one is getting lost in translation!

This is how things are:

There is Sharia that we are meant to follow, but in some instances things tend to get mixed up.

Ulama then pass fatwa here there and everywhere!

But those who don't have an insight, follow the fatwa (and there is no sin on their head for following the fatwa if done without knowing) and those who possess knowledge and KNOW the correct opinion follow the sharia and maintain Taqwa and abandon the fatwa.

Examples:

The Moon debate and the 18� rules for Salah times are the current predicaments.


The new trend:

(Please don't derail the thread from here) Shaykh worship! In this instance people abandon Sunnah and adopt the ways of their Shaykh. Some shuyukh have given advice incorrectly (I'm assuming that it's unintentional) some shuyukh are raised so high that no matter what they say, it becomes the "correct" way. It's these people who create the "Dial a Fatwa" trend and kill of everyone's Taqwa.

Until we don't see the dodgy fatwa, how can we accept that there is a huge difference in Fatwa vs Taqwa?

Fatwa Vs Taqwa is very real!
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#66 [Permalink] Posted on 30th March 2014 17:02

Anonymous wrote:
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Hazrat,

If you are referring to this Hadeeth of yours:

Indeed Halal is clear, and Haram is clear and between them are matters which are doubtful about which many people do not know about. The one who has TAQWA (abstains) from doubtful matters, he has safeguarded his DEEN and HONOUR, but he who falls into DOUBTFUL, he will (eventually) fall into HARAM, like the shepherd who pastures around the boundary, .......... Truly every king has a boundary, and truly ALLAH's boundary is the HARAM. Truly in the body there is a morsel of flesh, which, if it be whole, all the body is whole, and which, if it is diseased, all of [the body] is diseased. Truly, it is the heart.

Then apart from using bold fonts it adds nothing to the discussion at all!

The points you have raised so far are as follows:

  1. Allah (SWT) commands Muslims to adopt Taqwa
    1. Show me that ACTING on FATWA is contrary to Taqwa? Quote the reference please.
  2. Halal is clear and Haram is clear and he who falls into doubtful...
    1. Who is telling you that FATWA is doubtful? Are you accusing Shaykh (Mufti) Taqi Usmani (HA)) of giving rulings on doubtful matters instead of Halal?

My questions are as stated again...I have read 5 pages and I have not come across two simple answers:

  1. How is acting on good, sound Fatwa NOT Taqwa?
  2. Where is the above written in which book of Fiqh and which saying of which Imam?

Since according to you this is just a straightforward issue, it should be dead-easy for you to strike it down, Insha'Allah.

You have hyperactive imagination and a habit of putting ideas into people's heads! Nobody is discussing "Bad" or "Doubtful" Fatwaas we are discussed referring to authentic, honourable and pious Ulamah.

SHOW me one statement that acting on Fatwaas of such Ulamah is AGAINST (or different) to Taqwa?

Example is Shaykh (Mufti) Taqi Usmani (HA). I am a laymen and I act on his Fatwa? Where have I gone against Taqwa???

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#67 [Permalink] Posted on 30th March 2014 18:42
Just a few thoughts on this topic:

First off all I think for a laymen (especially in today's enviroment) to accept and act upon whatever the trusted Mufti rules for shows a lot of Taqwa. But does a Mufti enjoy the freedom to take the (spiritual) capacity of the questioner into consideration when issuing a fatwa? I remember to have heard examples of that from our pious Salaf, but at the moment don't remember any details.

Secondly, what some might consider giving Taqwa preference over Fatwa, others could say that the Taqwa part is actually a part of the Fatwa. A Mufti could for instance say: "The Salah offered without covering the head is totally valid, but we advise you to cover your head as is the blessed habit of our Nabi (sallallahu alayhi wasallam)." Now, the first group might consider the first part the Fatwa and the second part an advise to act upon Taqwa. But the second group will argue that the second sentence is an integral part of the Fatwa itself, because it's made clear that praying bareheaded equals neglecting the Sunnah. The same could be true for an action to be markuh, but the Mufti advising that it doesn't befit a Muslim and should be abondened.

Thirdly, aren't there many instances where pious elders acted more virtous than the actual fatwa demands of them? For example, technically it would be fine to not pray the Sunnah of 'Asr now and then, as it is Sunnah ghayr-Muakkadah. But I'm sure it won't be hard to find elders even today who are very strict on themselves and make sure to not miss their Sunnah of 'Asr Salah due to their piety. Now, you can fight over calling this "Fatwa vs. Taqwa" or "going the extra mile"...

I hope someone more knowledgable can help me to rectify my understanding on this, insha'Allah.
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#68 [Permalink] Posted on 30th March 2014 20:21

Anonymous wrote:
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Doesn't answer the question at all but side-steps it completly.

  1. A person needs to know something about his/her Deen
  2. This person asks Shaykh (Mufti) Taqi Usmani (HA) OR reads one of his Fatwaas in a book or listens or whatever
  3. He/She acts on it

Please explain as to according to which verse, which Hadeeth or which Madhab this is NOT Taqwa?

Hazrat Siraj has already called this question sensational so it should be pretty easy to answer for anyone.

In your question about Topi lets say that Shaykh (Mufti) Taqi Usmani (HA) says:

  • Salah is valid without a Topi
  • But it is advisable, praiseworthy and more virtous to pray with the head covered

So if a person then prays without a Topi then he hasn't really acted on the Fatwa has he? He has picked and chosen!

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#69 [Permalink] Posted on 30th March 2014 21:55
Muadh_Khan wrote:
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I did not intend to answer your questions, I was rather sharing my thoughts relevant to the general topic and also if necessary asked for correction. I don't know how you took my post as a direct reply (or even rebuttal) to yours. But I just want to reply since my post might have been too ambiguous:

1. Please read carefully: "First off all I think for a laymen (especially in today's enviroment) to accept and act upon whatever the trusted Mufti rules for shows a lot of Taqwa." So according to my deficient understanding acting on any reliable fatwa can not really be called acting contrary to Taqwa.

2. "So if a person then prays without a Topi then he hasn't really acted on the Fatwa has he? He has picked and chosen!" = "But the second group will argue that the second sentence is an integral part of the Fatwa itself, because it's made clear that praying bareheaded equals neglecting the Sunnah." I'm simply saying, how both groups conceive and describe the same reality in two different ways.

I would still appreciate some insight on the first question for the benefit of my own understanding: "But does a Mufti enjoy the freedom to take the (spiritual) capacity of the questioner into consideration when issuing a fatwa?" Jazak'Allah khayran...
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#70 [Permalink] Posted on 31st March 2014 09:40

Anonymous wrote:
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Hazrat,

You are making a number of errors in this regards.

Acting on the Fatwa of a trsuted Mufti in any era is Taqwa. Show me example or reference where it wasn't Taqwa in earlier times but its Taqwa today....I am Sorry but this isn't the right thought.

In today's world many Muftee don't see the one asking the question and the question may be online (email, facebook, whatsApp, text) so how are they supposed to evaluate the spiritual condition?

Secondly, there is no precondition for a Mufti to evaluate "spiritual condition" before giving a Fatwa in classical books of Islam anyways.

I believe that you are mixing Tassawuff with Fiqh.

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#71 [Permalink] Posted on 31st March 2014 10:12
The whole fatwa vs taqwa is I think merely about a point when you have two different fatwas, for example one mufti says machine mechanical slaughter meat is okay to consume, and another mufti says it should not be consumed and only hand slaughter should be eaten, then the laymen says, since hand slaughtered is Forsure without doubt okay, I will just stick to eating that , and with the fear of falling into sin and disobedience he leaves the other fatwa. So inshallah in the sight of Allah this man adopted taqwa.

Also acknowledging that the other fatwa might also be correct and people following that would have their own station in the sight of Allah. So it's not about comparing people and judging them , I guess it's more about the step and caution each person takes individually for himself and the intention and sincerity. Hence the advise we hear is to adopt caution ( taqwa) to the best of your ability.
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#72 [Permalink] Posted on 31st March 2014 10:20

Muadh_Khan wrote:
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Salam

1. The Hadith is of Nabi SAW, and it's disrespectful of you to say it in this manner "this hadith of yours", and also say that other than it being bold, adds nothing to the discussion. One ought to be careful about how they discuss the Blessed Hadith of Nabi SAW.

2. I already responded to your two questions (which is actually just one question). Your question, indeed, adds nothing to the discussion except a case of "whoever shouts louder must be right". Okay, so you want to shout louder than Hadith, but the Hadith and Qur'an are very clear.

3. Please see my response to your question, which was as follows:

"Your question assumes Fatwa and Taqwa are mutually exclusive.
One can be acting on a Fatwa and Taqwa at the same time.
One can be acting on a Fatwa, and NOT on Taqwa at the same time. "


4. You are further trying to sensationalise (shout louder, play on the emotion of the reader) by implying, that we are saying "Mufti Taqi's fatwa is devoid of Taqwa". Unfortunately, such media-type sensationalism is not going to fool the educated and sincere reader. Please read the Hadith of Nabi SAW (no, not "my hadith" - but Hadith of NABI SAW) again. In there, it is clearly mentioned that certain matters are clearly Halal, and certain clearly Haram. In between, are matters of doubt.

Now let's look at a scenario.

- Denying Salah is clearly HARAM
- Eating pure-sourced food is clearly HALAL
- Taking a mortgage from a Shariah-approved scheme is clearly DOUBTFUL

Now from the above three examples, the Fatwa of ALL muftis is in UNITY. The third one, has a MULTIPLICITY of opinion. Hence, from the perspective of the layman (and even the Ulama), there is confusion. Therefore, if one has the capacity, they should make Mujahadah and abstain from taking the Shariah-approved mortgage, because there are many scholars that say it is Haram. So one group say it is Halal, and another group say it is Haram. Therefore, the layman who is unable to critically assess the topic, may choose to act upon Taqwa, and refrain from them BOTH.

Similar example: 18deg 15deg fasting and salah in UK - stay in the "green zone" of both opinions, etc.

I hope this is now clear. My friend, if you want an example, then one has already been given of Imam Abu Hanifah and the stolen sheep! His fatwa was of permissibility, but his action was of Taqwa.

I anticipate the response that "you are making Deen hard on yourself to practice". Well yes, that's the point - ever heard of "Rukhsah" vs "Azeemah"? This is all over the books of Fiqh, and the Azeemah is the course of Taqwa in most cases (not necessarily ALL). You, on the other hand, are cutting off an entire portion of the Deen, and claiming the Quran Ayat and Ahadith on this subject are irrelevant.
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#73 [Permalink] Posted on 31st March 2014 10:21
Jazakallahu khayran! Finally someone on a common-wavelength!!

Guest-173681 wrote:
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#74 [Permalink] Posted on 31st March 2014 10:27

Anonymous wrote:
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Negative.

The job of a laymen is to consult reliable, honest, trustworthy Ulamah; once the ruling is received (even they differ) the laymen has a choice to take even the easiest one and this DOES NOT violate Taqwa at all.

Taqwa is abstention from sins and nothing to do with rulings of praiseworthy, pious and authentic Ulamah.

Shaykh (Mufti) Taqi Usmani (HA) has mentioned in one of his books that his father (while in Deoband) differed with Mufti (I can't remember the name) on some aspect of Qurbani and he says whenever someone came to him asking for a Fatwa he (RA) used to say:

  1. I say this
  2. Hazrat (Mufti) Saheb (HA) upstairs says this

If you want to act on his advice please go upstairs

This is the tolerance and understanding of our Akabir and it is not contrary to Taqwa at all to acknowledge the difference of pious Ulamah and refer people to them.

Taqwa has NOTHING to do with this issue. I have been asking over and over and over give examples and references where acting on Fatwa of praiseworthy, pious and authentic Ulamah is NOT Taqwa.

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#75 [Permalink] Posted on 31st March 2014 10:39

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First Problem:

The first problem with you is presumption because I ( you and everybody reading it) knows that I DID NOT ascribe Hadeeth of Nabi (Sallallaho Alaihe Wassallam) to you and its impossible.

What I meant is Hadeeth quoted by you and it is clear.

But what you have done is ignored the verse of the Qur'aan and then decided to lecture on presumptions stance:

[49:12] O you who believe, abstain from many of the suspicions. Some suspicions are sins. And do not be curious (to find out faults of others), and do not backbite one another. Does one of you like that he eats the flesh of his dead brother? You would abhor it. And fear Allah. Surely Allah is Most-Relenting, Very-Merciful.

Second Problem:

What we hearing is a lot of hot air from you but no examples or proofs. I have made a simple case for you and instead of writing the same thing over and over provide an example to prove that I am wrong!

There is NO SUCH REQUIREMENT in Shariah for a laymen to act on a unified Fatwa? Where did you get this idea from???

The laymen is only required to refer to himself/herself to pious, knowledgeable, Sunnah practising Mufti and obtain a ruling, act on it and he/she is absolved from his/her responsibility.

  1. How has a person who has consulted a pious, knowledgeable, Sunnah practising Mufti, obtained a ruling and acted on it done something CONTRARY to Taqwa?
  2. Where in the Qur'aan or Hadeeth (as you claim) talks about this practise being NOT Taqwa?

Hot air/sensationalim whatever you want to call it, all you need to do is articulate your point from Usool (principle). So far you have given nothing but stated the same thing in different ways.

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