Attacks on Tassawuff by Hamza Yusuf & others???

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#46 [Permalink] Posted on 13th November 2013 21:47

A different username seemed like wearing a rented Sherwani to a wedding... comfortable now.. Alhamdulillah..

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#47 [Permalink] Posted on 14th November 2013 04:07

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السلام عليكم و رحمة الله و بركاته

I think this is the excerpt of Ibn 'Abbad rahimahullah's explanation on giving bay'ah that S. Hamzah Yusuf referred to in the beginning of the lecture (from the link Uncle Mua'dh posted). It's content and what Shah Waliyullah Dihlawi Rahimahullah wrote about is relevant to the discussion - even though it's an old one.

I'm posting it (with bolding/italicizing of important parts) for the benefit of others...enjoy.

(1) As for the first question; is the pledge obligatory or Sunnah?

Know that the pledge is Sunnah and not obligatory. This is because the folk took the pledge from the Prophet (Allah bless him and give him peace) and sought proximity by it with Allah Most High, and there is no evidence indicating that one who foregoes it is a sinner, neither did any of the Imam's rebuke anyone who abstained from it.

www.deoband.org/2010/10/tasawwuf/shariah-and-tariqah-tasa...

The great jurist, theologian and muhaddith, Ibrahim ibn Musa ash-Shatibi rahmatulllahi 'alaih (d. 790 A.H.) wrote to the great Sufi Shaikh of his time, Muhammad ibn 'Abbad an-Nafzi rahmatullahi 'alaih (d. 792 A.H.). He wrote to him with regard to a question that came up in Granada (in Spain). Many 'Ulama differed in this matter and many people voiced different opinions in this regard. The question was: Is it compulsory for a salik (one who is treading the path towards Allah ) to adopt a Shaikhut Tariqah and Tarbiyyah under whose guidance he will tread this path? Or is it okay if his treading the path towards Allah is through studying and learning under 'ulama, without having a Shaikhut Tariqah?

Shaikh Ibn 'Abbad rahmatullahi 'alaih replied to him, the gist of which is this: "A Shaikh to who you refer in matters of sulook are of two types: a Shaikh who imparts knowledge and also Tarbiyyah , and a Shaikh at-Ta'lim who imparts knowledge without imparting Tarbiyyah. A Shaikh of Tarbiyyah is not necessary for every salik. A person who is mentally foolish and has a refractory soul needs such a Shaikh. As for that person who has sufficient intelligence and an obedient soul, it is not necessary for him to have such a Shaikh. But it is preferable for him to do so. As for the Shaikh who imparts knowledge alone, he is needed by every salik.

The reason why a Shaikhut Tarbiyyah is necessary for the salik whom we mentioned above is that the barriers of their souls are extremely dense. None but a Shaikhut Tarbiyyah can remove and wipe these barriers out. Such salikeen are like people who have physical ailments for a certain time and some bodily illnesses. Such people are in need of an expert physician who would treat them with strong medications.

As for that person who is sufficiently intelligent and has an obedient soul not requiring a Shaikhut Tarbiyyah is because his intelligence and his obedient soul make him independent and not in need of such a Shaikh. Such a person will remain steadfast on the actions which a Shaikh at-Ta'lim teaches him - actions on which others will not be able to remain steadfast. He will reach his goal by the Will of Allah . There is no fear of harm afflicting him in his path of sulook if he treads this path in the correct manner and approaches it as he ought to.

Relying on a Shaikhut Tarbiyyah is the way of the latter day Sufi Imams while relying on a Shaikh at-Ta'lim is the way of the early Sufi Imams. This becomes obvious from many of their writings, such as al-Harith al-Muahasibi, Abu Talib al-Makki and others. This is in the sense that they did not specify a Shaikhut Tarbiyyah in their writings in a manner done by latter day Imams. This despite the fact that they mentioned the fundamentals and subsidiary knowledge of the people together with its prerequisites and accessories. This is especially the case of Shaikh Abu Talib. The fact that they did not make mention of this is a proof that a Shaikhut Tarbiyyah is not a prerequisite in the path of sulook.

This is the way adopted by most of the salikeen. It is the way that most resembles the way of the past scholars. This is because it is not recorded that they adopted Shaikhs of Tarbiyyah, confined themselves to them, and bound themselves to them as murids bind themselves to the Shaikhs of Tarbiyyah. Their condition was that they used to acquire knowledge, reform their conditions through companionship and mutual brotherhood. Through this meeting with each other and visiting each other, they would acquire so much, that they would experience of this within themselves and in their external lives as well. They therefore traveled the lands with the intention of meeting the auliya, the 'ulama and those who were engrossed in the worship of Allah .

As for the books of the Sufis, they are referred to a Shaikh at-Ta'lim. This is because deriving benefit from them cannot be correct without the person reading them having this conviction that the writer of this book is a man of knowledge and cognition, and someone who is worthy of emulation.

Such conviction cannot be acquired except from a Shaikh whom he relies on in a way he trusts. If what he benefits from him is clear and clearly in accordance with the Shari'ah, he may suffice with that. If not, it is necessary for him to refer to a Shaikh - that is, a Shaikh at-Talim - who would explain to him. A Shaikh is therefore indispensable.

Ibn 'Abbad, ar-Risa'il as-Sughra, p. 106 and p. 125

Excerpt from Imam al-Muhasibi's Risalatul Mustarshidin, sharh by Shaikh 'Abdul-Fattah Abu Ghuddah and translated by Maulana Mahomed Mahomedy.
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الشكر قيد الموجود وصيد المفقود

Shukr binds the present (bounties) and traps the absent (bounties)

#48 [Permalink] Posted on 14th November 2013 11:55

dr76 wrote:

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Assalamualaykum wrwb,
Alhamdulillah, summa Alhamdulillah, already figured out from your posts(UI) that you are none other that dr76 of SF.
That day, I was about to comment on "username thread" but then didn't do so in respect of your privacy.
Khair, looking forward for your great posts.
duas...
Waasaslam.

Mods apologies for offtopic.

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#49 [Permalink] Posted on 14th November 2013 14:16

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Wa Alaikum Assalam w.w.

Kindly sign in.. we shall continue elsewhere إن شاء الله

request duas

wa Assalam..

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#50 [Permalink] Posted on 15th November 2013 11:55

Shaykh Suleiman the akabir ulema of deoband nearly every single one of them (I can't think of one who was not) was bait to a sufi shaykh. This is enough for us as proof. Having said that there are obvious problems with the sulook of today and that is why we need good people like you to take bait do some mujahidah and then get khilafat and start taking some mureeds.

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#51 [Permalink] Posted on 16th November 2013 09:18

Assalaamu 'alaykum ww

Brother london786, please don't take this as argumentative but I feel there is often too much generalisation. Your statement:

Quote:

there are obvious problems with the sulook of today

is only to do with sulook however generally on forums I find people concentrate more on faults than on good points of everything be it sulook, TJ, madrasahs etc etc. Yet we all agree that nothing and no one is perfect. No scholar is sinless or infallible and no system is perfect, yet Allah ta'ala has commanded us Believers to "fear Him and be with the Saadiqeen". So who and where are they? If there are none left how can we be blameworthy on the day of judgement?

...ok so check out the following scenario.

Standing in from Allah ta'ala (and may He enter us into His mercy without any accounting!)...

O Allah, in the time when I lived, everything had gone wrong.. everything had rotten apples within... see, the path of sulook had major problems, I didn't dare go that way...TJ, well that too had bad problems, I didn't bother with that. Masjids in my area, what can I say? none were run how they were supposed to with darul ulooms churning out incapable imams. I didn't want to go study in darul ulooms cause even there things had gone bad.. from teachers, to those who ran them and the syllabus they chose...what else was there? so I just didn't bother about being with the saadiqeen as there were none left!

brother, there will always be truthful ones, all we need to do is search, make the best possible research on their credentials and "be with them". They could be in khanqas, or on the path of TJ or as simple, unknown imams in the local masjids or some pious soul somewhere. What do you think? Am I waffling on uselessly or maybe theres something in this even though I'm just a nisful aql woman?

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#52 [Permalink] Posted on 16th November 2013 12:31

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ummi taalib wrote:

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wa Alaikum Assalam w.w.

Agree with Mohtaram Khala..

The following are the guidelines for general populace given by Hazrat Shaikh Zulfiqar Ahmed Naqshbandi db in his book Connection of Divinity.. the book was gifted by dearest bro London786..

contd..

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#53 [Permalink] Posted on 16th November 2013 12:32

contd..

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#54 [Permalink] Posted on 16th November 2013 12:33

END

wa Assalam..

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#55 [Permalink] Posted on 16th November 2013 16:56

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Of course, there's no denying that. One will be hard pressed to find our isnad without these Masha'ikh. The problem that I have with some is, when one already accepts the validity of Tazkiyyah, realizes its importance, benefits from the suhbah of the Masha'ikh in Tasawwuf and their advices, encourages others to benefit from them as well but, just because he's not bay'ah to a Shaykh he is considered spiritually deficient or not connected to Tasawwuf at the very least.

That, I can't accept. And the reason why is from what the Masha'ikh of Tasawwuf themselves have said about this very issue. Shaikh Zakariyyah Kandhlawi Rahmatullahi 'alaihi mentioned in his book, in the chapter of bay'ah that's it's not even a requirement among the Sufiyyah. Then went on to explain how the practice of bay'ah is deeply rooted in the Qur'an and Sunnah. In the same chapter, he quotes Shah Waliyyullah Rahmatullahi 'alaih:

Know that the pledge is Sunnah and not obligatory. This is because the Sahabah (anhum) took the pledge from Rasulullah (saw)

and sought proximity by it with Allah Most High, and there is no evidence indicating that one who foregoes it is a sinner, neither did any of the Imam's rebuke anyone who abstained from it.

During my early Madrasah days and during my time in Jama'ah, I asked two qualified Shaikhs (who were Ulama as well) whos qualities inspired me to take bay'ah at their hands. Guess what? One said, "Go to someone else." and the other said, "Do such and such A'mal." In the end, both declined giving bay'ah to me. If bay'ah was a necessity for each and every person, then I'm sure that they would have given it.

So my thing is, if someone has already accepted Tasawwuf but doesn't have bay'ah, then please ease up on him and don't make him feel inferior because of not having bay'ah.

"...good people like me..." lol I'll be good if my ending is good and Allah Ta'ala considers me as such.

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الشكر قيد الموجود وصيد المفقود

Shukr binds the present (bounties) and traps the absent (bounties)

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#56 [Permalink] Posted on 16th November 2013 17:02

ummi taalib wrote:

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Very sensible and informative post.

Jazakumullahu khairan, Khalah.

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الشكر قيد الموجود وصيد المفقود

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#57 [Permalink] Posted on 16th November 2013 17:42

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Agree Hafiz sahab.. mostly these Mashaikh refuse taking bayat giving preference to others over themselves..
also they assert that Islah is fardh and Bayat is sunnah..

Hazrat Shaikh ul Hadeeth sahab رحمة الله عليه would send people to Hazrat Madani رحمة الله عليه or Hazrat Raipuri رحمة الله عليه saying he would not take thier bayat when his elders were present.. if someone kept on requesting.. then Hazrat shaikh رحمة الله عليه did consider..

This was the case with many Mashaikh.. while some did take Bayat fearing they might land up with a biddati..

I have seen people queing at Hazrat Maulana Shah Abrarul Haq sahab Hardoi رحمة الله عليه for bayat.. but Hazrat رحمة الله عليه was very strict..

once while in Bangalore.. many people had come with the hope of getting bayat.. and Hazrat رحمة الله عليه seemed in a good mood.. then a Hafiz sahab came forwards with a question.. he said he was bayat to him.. now Hazrat asked Hafiz sahab since how many years.. and he replied 7 - 8 years..

That was it.. Maulana rebuked him saying ' you are bayat since past 7 years and i have heard nothing from you.. what do you think ..is this a joke or something..' so thanks to the Hafiz sahab none could take bayat.. :-)

so yes.. the Mashaikh insist on Islah.. and bayat can come later on..

duas..

wa Assalam..

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#58 [Permalink] Posted on 16th November 2013 22:02

dr76 wrote:

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Yes, the islah is a must and that is obtained with suhbah, which can be obtained by at least one of the two types of Shaykhs that were mentioned in Ibn 'Abbad's rahimahullah risalah.

It's an order from Allah Ta'ala to be in the suhbah of the pious...you can't really get around that. No matter what one's position is of Tasawwuf.

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#59 [Permalink] Posted on 17th November 2013 02:47

Sulaiman84 wrote:

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Yes and the Afdhal among the two is the one who has Sanad for Islah ie, one who has himself undergone Islah sitting at the feet of Ahlullah and was granted Ijazah to carry on the Noble work..

wa Assalam..

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#60 [Permalink] Posted on 17th November 2013 05:03

dr76 wrote:

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True, dr sahib.

لكل فن رجال

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الشكر قيد الموجود وصيد المفقود

Shukr binds the present (bounties) and traps the absent (bounties)

Attacks on Tassawuff by Hamza Yusuf & others???

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