Fajar Jamaat at 01:30 until Ramadhan (Walthamstow area UCS)

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#1 [Permalink] Posted on 23rd May 2012 12:08

Assalamu 'alaykum wa rahmatullahi wabarakatuhu

For those that live in or near the Walthamstow area UCS at 111 Markhouse
Rd E17 8DQ will be holding Fajr jamaat now at 1:30am until Ramdhan.

Jazakullah Khairun

"this post is from Daywalk3r"

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#2 [Permalink] Posted on 23rd May 2012 18:39

That must be a non Hanafi Masjid. According to the MyMasjid App, the earliest Fajar gets too is 2.39am and that too before mid June.

Khair, it is still allowed for us to pray behind an Imam according to their times.

Jazakallah brother Daywalk3r.

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#3 [Permalink] Posted on 24th May 2012 16:32

Also up in north they have fajar salah at 1.30am that is a Hanafi Masjid but its strange that the Dewsbury Margaz have a different time for Fajar I would say around 2.40 am. In Ramadhan the begining time for Fajar is 1.30am but towards the end of ramadhan its around after 3.00 am

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#4 [Permalink] Posted on 24th May 2012 19:19

Jazakallah, the time difference between London, where this particular Masjid is and up North is a lot in summer.

Maghrib in London doesn't go beyond 9.30pm but up north, it is much much later.

Also there is this issue for a few days in this country where the time for Maghrib doesn't really finish for Isha to start. So I guess they are taking advantage of this period.

I have posted this info here before, I just need to locate it inshaAllah and add it here.

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#5 [Permalink] Posted on 24th May 2012 23:20

"abu mohammed" wrote:

Jazakallah, the time difference between London, where this particular Masjid is and up North is a lot in summer. Maghrib in London doesn't go beyond 9.30pm but up north, it is much much later. Also there is this issue for a few days in this country where the time for Maghrib doesn't really finish for Isha to start. So I guess they are taking advantage of this period. I have posted this info here before, I just need to locate it inshaAllah and add it here.

Here's the details I posted last year.

http://www.muftisays.com/forums/the-true-salaf-as-saliheen/5980/the-salafi-hijack.html?p=31005#31005

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#6 [Permalink] Posted on 24th May 2012 23:42

I'm no expert at this, I'll leave that to the scholars. It's the principle I'm looking at. The above is to.do.with Isha time, nit Fajar.

Anyone with better understanding, please reply and correct my comments. I know I'm not entirely correct.

Jazakallahu khair.

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#7 [Permalink] Posted on 24th May 2012 23:49

Isn't there a Sunnah time for Fajr? Closest to the end? I was told to read Maghrib asap and Fajr near the end with Jamaa'ah or any time if praying alone?

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#8 [Permalink] Posted on 25th May 2012 01:02

super-glue wrote:

Isn't there a Sunnah time for Fajr? Closest to the end? I was told to read Maghrib asap and Fajr near the end with Jamaa'ah or any time if praying alone?

Better to delay (Hanafi opinion):

The Prophet (Allah bless him and give him peace) said, "Pray fajr when it is bright, for it is greater in reward". [Reported by Imam al-Tirmidhi and others . Imam al-Tirmidhi commented that most of the Companions used to pray fajr at this time.]

This is the recommended time to pray fajr for men. [Nur al-Idah]

Therefore, one should pray with the congregation in the mosque at this time. If, however, the congregation is commenced before the recommended time, then one still joins the congregation and does not wait for the recommended time to pray alone or with a group at home. If one misses the congregation in the masjid, then it's recommended for him to wait and pray in the recommended time.

Women, on the other hand, should pray fajr when it is still dark. [Maraqi al-Falah]

http://qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.asp?HD=1&ID=5000&CATE=98

Better to perform early:

Ibn Qudaamah said in al-Mughni (1/540):�With regard to Fajr prayer, it is better to pray when it is still dark. This is the view of Maalik, al-Shaafa'i and Ishaaq. There is also evidence to this effect narrated from Abu Bakr, 'Umar, Ibn Mas'ood, Abu Moosa, Ibn al-Zubayr and 'Umar ibn 'Abd al-'Azeez.

al-Bukhaari (560) and Muslim (646) narrated that Jaabir ibn 'Abd-Allaah said: The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) used to pray Fajr when it was still dark (ghalas).�

The word "ghalas" refers to the darkness at the end of the night, as it says in the dictionary, and that is the beginning of the dawn.�[Islam Q&A]

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#9 [Permalink] Posted on 26th May 2012 14:21

I accept the starting time for Fajar to be early as we should be following 18degrees. But I'd still prefer to follow the hadith mentioned above. However, as the time starts early, this means shuhoor/sehri will also be early.

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#10 [Permalink] Posted on 26th May 2012 16:37

Another fine example of why Taqleed is so important.

When one chooses to follow and understand Ahadeeth according to their own interpretations, they will follow the ruling of early Fajr for the sake of reading early so they can go to sleep after yet in Ramadhan, they will follow the other opinion so they get an hour less of hunger. So those who claim to not follow one school of Fiqh are actually following the school of desires.

Regarding times and rulings, please consult a Mufti before researching yourself as it will always be inconclusive.

(All the above is not in relation to the Masjid who are doing Fajr early. It is in relation to the last few posts)

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#11 [Permalink] Posted on 29th May 2012 15:26

Further clarification, it's not in relation to 18d either (as this subject is very well researched by one of my teachers over 15 years ago). It's in relation to switching rulings for convenience. In the legal status of following a Madhab, Mufti Sahib gives such examples where rules and times can defer and when one chooses to follow one way when it suits then it's following Nafs and not Sharee'ah - this was actually my only point. Apologies to those who might have misunderstood as many times I just reply with related things but it remains unclear what I meant. - Jazakallah for the email MJ addressing this.

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#12 [Permalink] Posted on 29th May 2012 16:22

Wrt the view of delaying Fajr till its lateness yes that is the view that even those who follow the 18d time follow. i.e. Queens Rd, Tooting Masjid, Croydon Masjid, Seven Kings masjid, Jame and IDAUK in Leic, some masjids in Batley and Dewsbury etc though all have the early 18d fajr time everyone of them has Fajr Jamaat, at the optimal/preferred time, just before sunrise.

However there are venues here and there that have the very early 18d fajr time which allows for those that work till late to pray Fajr with jamaat, those who are still awake near that time having prayed Esha at 10:45pm and possibly got home about 11:30ish otherwise if they sleep v.late at night they might risk the possibility of missing their Fajr altogether. Though in Ramdhan time most/all who follow 18d times would post probably have the main masjid Fajr Jamaat nearer that 18d time (maybe not exact i.e. approx 45mins after 18d time).

I think there is a clear need, and advantage, for those areas that do follow 18d time to have least 1 (smaller) Jamaat at the early 18d time outside the main local masjid i.e. like the Markhouse Rd place which is a Community Centre.

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#13 [Permalink] Posted on 29th May 2012 16:28

Assalamu Alaykum,

I was contacted about the context of my statements. First and foremost, Jazakallahu Khayran for contacting me directly to ask for an explanation and clarification. This is the way it should be. I have been informed how it was perceived due to my lack of explanation.

Note, my reference was towards Talfeeq. This is the combining of ruling and the mixing and matching of rulings to suit ones desires. In this particular issue i.e. performing Fajr Salaah after 18 degrees, Talfeeq does not apply.

This is because 18 degrees is accepted by the majority of scholars across the world for Subh Sadiq, therefore if a person was to act on 18 degrees to perform Fajr for convenience or for any other purpose there would be no problem with this at all.

I pray this is clear now. Jazakumullah

Wassalam

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#14 [Permalink] Posted on 29th May 2012 17:54

Agree with Maulana and Daywalk3r.

My only point us that since Fajar starts early regardless if what time it can or should be prayed, the question remains for shuhoor/sehri and I think this what Maulana was also implying in the first post.

According to the saheeh 18d law, most Muslims will be eating into their Fajar time and then kee their fast. This is where the problem lies.

This a dangerous situation.

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#15 [Permalink] Posted on 29th May 2012 23:59

Is there an .18d timetable available

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Fajar Jamaat at 01:30 until Ramadhan (Walthamstow area UCS)

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