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The great Taqleed Debate

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#61 [Permalink] Posted on 21st August 2020 11:56
Concerned wrote:
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Already answered.

Taqleed is obligatory and as long as this person is seeking opinions from reputable Ulama it is Taqleed. You seem to favour "Taqleed Mutlaq" over "Taqleed Shaksi" and its fine and in your opinion "Taqleed Mutlaq" suits the needs and requirements of our time better and that is not an issue. If the person is consulting Mufti Taha Karaan (HA) or someone trustworthy and making Taqleed of him, its fine with me.

I am not South African so don't really have a problem with that as per the views of Maulana Ashraf Ali Thanwi (RA) on Taqleed.
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#62 [Permalink] Posted on 21st August 2020 11:57
Muadh_Khan wrote:
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So how is that "dysentery of religiosity" when someone else considers it "impermissible" based on Taqleed of another Mufti of repute?
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#63 [Permalink] Posted on 21st August 2020 12:00
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The Doubtful Matters

Most people don’t understand what doubtful matters are and what their ruling is. There are two things scholars have said about doubtful matters. The first opinion is that doubtful matters are those that scholars disagree about their permissibility: music, for example. The second opinion is that doubtful matters are those that mix between halal and haram. The general rule regarding doubtful matters is whoever stays away from them has purified their deen and honor.

The scholars differ on whether doubtful matters are halal or haram.

  • One opinion is that all doubtful matters are haram, due the saying of the Messenger (sas) in this hadith "[he] clears himself in regard to his religion and his honor."
  • Another opinion is that all doubtful matters are halal, due the statement of the Prophet (sas) "like the shepherd who pastures around a sanctuary.” This indicates that these actions are permissible, but leaving them is from piety.
  • And a third opinion is that we make no ruling regarding the doubtful matters, and do not say that they are halal or haram, as the Prophet (sas) placed them between the clear halal and the clear haram. Hence we should refrain from passing judgment, and this, too, is from piety.


The Prophet (sas) follows the statement, “between the two of them are doubtful matters” by saying, “most people do not know them.” This means that some people do. It is the job of scholars to put forth their best effort in looking at all of the evidence and reaching their opinion. If they are correct, they receive two rewards and if they are wrong they are still rewarded. For those of us who are following opinions of the scholars, that is all that is required from us. But we should keep in mind that staying away from doubtful matters purifies our deen and honor.

40hadithnawawi.com/hadith/6-protecting-the-heart/
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#64 [Permalink] Posted on 21st August 2020 12:02
bint e aisha wrote:
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The other way around.

The one who consider it "impermissible" look down upon others as "lacking Taqwa" and it is common observation. As long as both sides see that this is a matter of "disagreement" and the Mufti is of repute, trustworthy and rigorous and not XYZ.

There is a well known website who has made a profession out of calling others all kinds.

The Animal Rennet Fatwa is a fine example, it isn't just Mufti Taqi Usmani (HA) but many others (before and after) although in the minds of people his name is associated with it. If this was just Mufti Taqi Usmani (HA), then it would be a singular individual opinion but it isn't e.g. "Strawberries are Haram..."

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#65 [Permalink] Posted on 21st August 2020 13:28
bint e aisha wrote:
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I think what the brother meant was that once the Mufti that he adheres to has given a fatwa of permissibility, that will suffice for him. He will not seek out a fatwa of impermissibility just because he thinks that a fatwa of impermissibility is superior to the former. That's the dysentry here. And believe it or not, there are people who do think like this. There are also those who think the exact opposite. In any given sample of a population from Pakistan you will find both kinds of people. One kind seeks out fatwas of impermissibility on doubtful matters because they believe that whoever is forbidding it is the morally superior Mufti. The other kind seeks fatwas of permissibility in doubtful matters because they want there to be some way they can get around the doubt and actually indulge in the act without incurring the wrath of Allah.
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#66 [Permalink] Posted on 21st August 2020 13:37
Strawberries is common example being given. One in which most will disagree with the ruling of Haram.

A complicated one would be Shellac. This is found to be Haram and then Halal. Some Ulama will still opt for the Haram opinion whilst others will now retract their previous position and accept the research and findings of another reputable Mufti even though they know that shellac is from an insect.

Its situations like these that should be talked about and understood, rather than switching to one's needs as per the occasion of ease on silly arguments.
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#67 [Permalink] Posted on 21st August 2020 14:17
abu mohammed wrote:
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Once again you are confusing "disagreement" with "doubtful".

Once Mufti Taqi Usmani (HA) has issued a Fatwa on Shellac it is no longer doubtful as he has come to a conclusion. SANHA has the opposite view but they have also come to a clear conclusion.

Something cannot be doubtful if there is a "Judgement" on it.

Taqwa is a personal issue and you can't force it down my throat and neither can you judge me on Taqwa, it is a pretty clear issue in Islam....You can only judge me on "Fatwa".
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#68 [Permalink] Posted on 21st August 2020 14:19
fod1083 wrote:
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Quote:
One kind seeks out fatwas of impermissibility on doubtful matters because they believe that whoever is forbidding it is the morally superior Mufti. The other kind seeks fatwas of permissibility in doubtful matters because they want there to be some way they can get around the doubt and actually indulge in the act without incurring the wrath of Allah.

Please enlighten me. Is there anything wrong with picking the option of permissibility given by a Mufti of repute?
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#69 [Permalink] Posted on 21st August 2020 14:20
fod1083 wrote:
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Buying a House in UK on Mortgage

  1. Buy on an unIslamic Mortgage which is absolutely Haram
  2. Buy on HSBC Amanah Mortgage which is per missable according to Mufti Taqi Usmani (HA)


You have hundreds of Muslim couples who make decisions like this all the time.
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#70 [Permalink] Posted on 21st August 2020 14:26
bint e aisha wrote:
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If that particular sentence is offensive, please disregard it. I did not intend to disparage the Mufti who declared it impermissible. Both Muftis are eminently worthy of respect.
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#71 [Permalink] Posted on 21st August 2020 14:32
abuzayd2k wrote:
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I am no Mufti but wouldn't that depend on the matter at hand? As an example, take the case of wages for leading Taraweeh prayers. Mufti Zarwali Khan (HA), a Mufti of significant repute, especially here in Karachi allows it to his students to demand a wage for the Taraweeh prayers. The Jamhoor ulema reject this opinion of his. So much so, that in one of his bayans, Mufti Tariq Masood was pleading with Mufti Zarwali Khan's students to forego their teacher's fatwa on this particular issue and to follow the Jamhoor on this particular issue. And all that without criticizing Mufti Zarwali. He was of the opinion that we can respect his particular opinion on this but cannot recommend it.
So should those students really seek out their teacher (a Mufti of repute) for a fatwa of permissibility because it obviously benefits them?

I would like to know the answer to this as much as you.
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#72 [Permalink] Posted on 21st August 2020 16:53
fod1083 wrote:
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If other Muftis allow it, then there should be no problem. If other Muftis say it's an isolated opinion, then it would be a problem.
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#73 [Permalink] Posted on 21st August 2020 17:21
fod1083 wrote:
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I was always deadest against paying the Huffadh until I heard the other side. I sat in a Mushwara of Senior British Ulama (as an observer) and problems were highlighted and this Mushwara was held due to Mufti Zarwali Khan Saheb (HA)'s opinion and its impact in Britain.

Many of the (young) Huffadh come from a working class family background and they are either newly married or on the verge of getting married when they lead their first Taraweehs. The income is badly needed but Darul-uloom Dewsbury has a strict rule to not allow this to happen.

I heard case by case of youngsters and their family and financial situation.

The compromise ins best in Britain where some leading members of the community take a collection and donate it as "Hadyah" to the Huffadh and no public announcement or collection is made so nobody is embarrassed.

I see Mufti Zarwali Khan Saheb (HA)'s point of view but "wages for Qur'aan" or the "Imam" in the Hanafi Madhab are not permitted. At the same time we need to look at the financial needs of under 20s who do not have any other skillset to earn good money to start their lives.

I see the problem from both sides and also see the solution as implemented in Britain and it is the best. I also know what happens in Pakistan but it does damage the self-respect of Huffadh as many in Pakistan look at the Ulama and Huffadh as money hungry any ways.

Ulama and Huffadh also have to pay bills...
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#74 [Permalink] Posted on 21st August 2020 17:55
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Why not!

Whilst travelling, I stopped for some food and walked into a Halal food outlet.

I wanted something lite so I could my dodgy wudhu for longer.

I decided to have prawns which have two opinions in my school and I opted for the option of eating prawns. But I saw shrimp on the menu which I never had because its haram in my school. But since I'm traveling and giving myself much leeway, I decided to have shrimp since it was allowed in the Maliki school..

By the end of the day, I didn't have wudhu, nor offered salah correctly and ate haram for ease and convenience

What a day!

And this happens all the time with people who jump schools.
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#75 [Permalink] Posted on 21st August 2020 18:47
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I decided to have prawns which have two opinions in my school and I opted for the option of eating prawns. But I saw shrimp on the menu which I never had because its haram in my school. But since I'm traveling and giving myself much leeway, I decided to have shrimp since it was allowed in the Maliki school..

By the end of the day, I didn't have wudhu, nor offered salah correctly and ate haram for ease and convenience


Actually prawns and shrimps are used interchangeably in the hanafi school so you would have eaten halal according to your madhab. But hey if you want to think your whole day was spent in haram and messing up actions that's up to you.
PS: make sure to you don't ever get any cross contamination from lobsters in halal sea food restaurants.

And prawns and shrimps are halal in the hanabali school as well so your day was still perfectly fine as a hanbali.
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