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Osama Bin Ladin "Shaheed" by Imran Khan

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#31 [Permalink] Posted on 26th June 2020 14:23
fod1083 wrote:
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Yes, he was Shaheed inshaAllah , and yes, we should realise that although his ideals were correct, his strategy did not prove very beneficial to the ummah.
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#32 [Permalink] Posted on 26th June 2020 14:37
joy wrote:
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Which strategy?
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#33 [Permalink] Posted on 26th June 2020 15:43
Benazir Bhutto was neither Ismaili nor Shia when she died, confirmed from Karachi with someone who knew the situation first-hand.

When Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto married her (Shia) mother, he took a Maulvi for the Nikah to which Nusrat Bhutto Isfahani said that she was "Shia" so wanted a Shia Nikah while Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto said that he wanted a "Sunni Maulvi" so both Sunni and Shia Nikah were done.

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#34 [Permalink] Posted on 26th June 2020 16:49
she married shia zardari and their children identify as shia. go on shiachat and other shia portals they openly show both being shia.

also what qualifies her being a shaheed? she didnt die fighting or promoting islam? she was a filthy liberal who wanted pakistan to become even more western. if king abdullah got shot dead or if MSB is killed will we call him a shaheed too? still cant believe people are more happy calling her a shaheed than usama رضي الله عنه who fought fighting for islam his entire life. too many saadatin kopeks around
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#35 [Permalink] Posted on 26th June 2020 17:06
For the sake of information:
Quote:
Who was Sadettin Kopek (Dirilis Ertugrul Character)
Sa’ad al-Din Kopek was a famous character of Resurrection Dirilis Ertugrul who consistently hindered Ertugrul and was a competitor and opponent of the Ertugrul Ghazi.
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#36 [Permalink] Posted on 26th June 2020 17:25
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#37 [Permalink] Posted on 26th June 2020 19:06
It comes down to the word of brother Muadh's source with first hand knowledge of the issue versus the opinion of posters on shiachat and other online fora.

The fatwa above should put the matter to rest.
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#38 [Permalink] Posted on 26th June 2020 23:12
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As I said previously, calmly unravel things in your mind one at a time. You can disagree with someone but structure your thoughts properly.

  1. No Non-Muslim can be declared a Shaheed be it pope or even Bashar Al-Asad etc because they are Alawi-Kaafir. That answers your series of questions about XYZ.
  2. Benazir never claimed or lived to be a practising Muslim so that matter is with Allah Ta'ala
  3. Her mother and husband were/are also Shia, that is also another matter for Allah Ta'ala
  4. She did horrendous things as the Prime Minister and did untold damage to Islam and Muslims through her actions
  5. But if you have any information on her Kuf'r then bring it our attention.


Any "Muslim" who dies a certain way is a Shaheed be it he/she may be the ultimate sinner and that is Islam. Plenty of non-practising (sinning) Muslims are passing away with Coronavirus and we deem them to be Shaheed.

Feel free to disagree and don't call her a Shaheed if it pains you but Allah Ta'ala's Mercy is vast.

Loading Hadeeth

It is not the end of the world to not address her as a Shaheed (doesn't matter), it is also fine to think of her as a Shia (mother + husband) but Kaafir she was not unless you have something categoric and conclusive on the issue.

She dint renounce "Islam" either.

Loading Hadeeth
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#39 [Permalink] Posted on 26th June 2020 23:45
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My old my hands up ans retract. Ive always been told since I was a kid she was an ismaaili and heard from various people and ulema but non knew her personally. I trust you and thus if the guy u know knew her personally and is sayin she was a sunni and didn't hold any kufr beliefs i have to take that.

As for shaheed i can't accept that. If a drug dealer gets shot by a fellow drug dealer i won't call him a shaheed. She is no different to the sellout apostate regimes we have around the world today. They will and do sell the ummah down the river at drop of hat and worship the 'rabb' of the white House instead of the Rabb of the black House (kabah)
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#40 [Permalink] Posted on 26th June 2020 23:51
There are different types of shaheed.

There are those who are alive and we can't say they are dead and there are those who are dead.

Allah will deal with each in His own way. That's not for us to discuss, similarly, those who are dying of the virus, they will be at different levels and Allah will deal with them that is most just. But at the end of the day, the label given is "Shaheed"

Not all the Shaheed's souls will be flying in the hearts of green birds under the arsh of Allah!
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#41 [Permalink] Posted on 27th June 2020 00:00
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His actual point is lost in the clumsy arguments which he is advancing.

What he is actually trying to say is that people are arguing about Benazir being Shaheed and issuing Fatwaas while at best using (RA) for Osama Bin Ladin (RA) who actually fought for Islam most of his life and is a genuine Shaheed

What he is not saying clearly is that it is politically correct and convenient to discuss Benazir being Shaheed and politically incorrect and inconvenient to address Osama Bin Ladin (RA) as Shaheed.

I don't think anybody would argue with his actual point but dude is from London so he has to say things in a roundabout way about Drug dealers etc...
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#42 [Permalink] Posted on 27th June 2020 00:29
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Lol you seem to know me too well. Yes that is my point. If benazir is worthy of shaheed then common sense dictates usama MUST be a shaheed as he is a shaheed in real sense of word and the highest form as mentioned in numerous hadith.

Otherwise nearly every Muslim is shaheed. Dying from illness, stomach illness, drowning, fire makes one a shaheed. Im sure you can find some hadith to even call Muslims who died from covid shaheed.
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#43 [Permalink] Posted on 27th June 2020 05:59
We can consider both to be shaheed, albeit at different levels, no harm in that. It doesn't lessen Osama's status in our eyes, and it doesn't mean we are rejecting the bad that was done by Benazir during her life. But while we can focus on the former, we can't focus on the latter because that's like asking Allah why did you forgive someone who was the source of corruption in this world. Can anyone ask Allah that? No, right? He can forgive whomever he wants and he can erase all proof of their bad deeds if he wants. So we shouldn't really focus on anything other than the fact that inshaAllah a sinner's hereafter has been salvaged by Allah.
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#44 [Permalink] Posted on 27th June 2020 06:03
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Well in Pakistan politicians are held with reverance and their celebrity status is higher then any other profession. Equivalent to Sport Stars
And actors and musicians in the West.

Even a local district Councillor is considered a major celebrity and personality.

I was in Pakistan when Benazir Bhutto was assasinated people were crying commiserating and consoling each other over Benazir.

If you find Benazir being called a Shaheed surprising. Let me tell you people were actually saying that after the Mothers of the believers and Sayyidina Fatima RA... The greatest woman from this Ummah is Benazir.

Thats the level of Jahalliyah... If you even offer minor criticism about her political career people are ready to physically attack you. Same goes for any of their favourite politicians be it Musharaf, Nawaz Sharif or anyone else.

In Pakistan and many other muslim countries they have something that could be loosely described as Politician worship. The sanctification of these personalities is next level.

Another bizarre thing is out of all the politicians of recent times. The only one people seem to have little objection with being criticised is Zia Ul Haq and he is the only one who had an attachment to the deen. It is
also not a requirement to refer to him as Shaheed you can just attach the label of Marhoom to him.

The media and political establishment have chosen to label Benazir as Shaheed and have sanctified her.

So I would take any Fatwa from any Dar Ul Uloom in Pakistan saying its okay to call her Shaheed. With a pinch of salt. If any fatwa department from a Dar Ul Uloom said she should not be labelled Shahid the media would furiously attack them and the public would form a mob to burn the entire establishment to the ground.

As far as being Shia or Sunni I doubt if she even really new the differences...was never given religious education and was shipped off to Boarding Schools and Universities for academic studies. To prepare her for a life in politics.

In order to win votes politicians pretend to be religious.

And even known Shias like Zardari pretend to be Sunni for political expediency because they do not want to alienate the majority Sunni Population of the country. He offers all his Eid Salahs in Sunni Masajid likewise any other Salahs such as Jumah are offered in front of the cameras in Sunni Masajid. And when he dies his children will make sure his Janazah is performed by a Sunni Imam.



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#45 [Permalink] Posted on 27th June 2020 07:35
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Was Usama bin Laden RA martyred by America or did he die a natural death?
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