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The Reality of Western Society.

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#31 [Permalink] Posted on 17th April 2020 16:27
ssaad wrote:
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Quote:
Maulana Ilyas RA was passing near a cinema theater. Some one said, "all those young men standing in Que for movie are muslims".
Maualana Ilyas RA said, when a masjid is attacked by enemies, the same young men risk their lives and protect the masjid.


Mashallah. Very true.
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#32 [Permalink] Posted on 17th April 2020 16:27
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It reminds me of an incident about 20yrs ago. Palestine was under attack youth from uk were part of the demonstration in Palestine it was some sort of human rights group.

They came on national news to everyone’s shock my friends youngest brother inlaw was there they had linked arm to arm protecting the masjid from attack from the solidiers.

The brother inlaw was from a non practising family. My heart just melted. He was risking his life for one of the most sacred places in Islam. Never judge anyone.
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#33 [Permalink] Posted on 17th April 2020 16:37
abuzayd2k wrote:
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Quote:
(salam)

There is actually debate among experts between what is more damaging, economic stagnation or widespread loss of life. This argument is best left to the experts and policy makers who have to live with the consequences of their decisions. I for one am thankful that I don't have to shoulder any responsibility for such a difficult decision.


Wallahi I feel the same all the time.....that is I too am glad that I do not have to share any responsibility in such difficult decisions.

I shall add the next part later on Insha Allah.
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#34 [Permalink] Posted on 17th April 2020 16:52
I am from the West.
I have a label and I wear it!

I am identified as a citizen of the west yet my outward label says otherwise!

There is nothing wrong in working for a living. The wrong is chasing for it. The wrong is in yearning for it.

At the same time, I sit and eat with people from the East in their homes and see that they are more Western than many of us!

They dress me Western than us.

I eat with my hands (fingers), they use spoons. I wear a Jabbah in the UK and and when abroad (except for when going to work etc) they wear jeans and shirts.

The Reality of the East is that they prefer the way of the West because they have everything else of importance on a plate, they have the deen for free!

The East have a label, yet they wear the label of the west.

The East have a way of living, yet they live like they are westerners.

I've seen both sides on all spectrums, maybe others have only heard what the west is and compare to the east.
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#35 [Permalink] Posted on 17th April 2020 16:55
abu mohammed wrote:
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The discussion here is not about muqallids of western culture, migrants from east etc.

We are discussing the real creators of western society, the real masters of western society, irrespective of their religion.
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#36 [Permalink] Posted on 17th April 2020 17:13
Does anyone in this thread that Muslims ruled Sicily (Italy) and in books of Maliki Madhab the "opinion of the West" is actually a valid technical term?

The official Madhab of Europe was "Maliki" until the Hanafees came and became dominant in Europe

Well Hanafees kind of became dominant everywhere but that's a different topic :)
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#37 [Permalink] Posted on 17th April 2020 17:30
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#38 [Permalink] Posted on 18th April 2020 05:02
I disagree. Materialism is stronger in the East actually. Servants and fancy cars and European name brands we never heard of in Canada/USA. Because in the East everything centers around surviving in a poor world, the dunya dominates the heart more. Its suvival mentality that transforms to dunya-seeking mentality. Imam Ghazali says you can have the dunya in your heart, even if you have no money in your hand. And ulema in the East know their followers are simple. They encourage taqleed and what academics call "un-thought." And because they have just been surviving in the East, the dunya will overwhelm them if they go to the West. And its true. Muslims who immigrate to the West lose their deen and sell out and forget their heritage. Until some non-Muslim reminds them of their place and that no matter how Western they become, they are not white. Regardless, Allah guides whom He wills.

Materialism is not as strong in the West because even a poor man is taken care of by the government. Many Muslims live on welfare. What is stronger in the West is: Independence. Everybody lives purely for themselves. No care for elders or children. More vulnerability to vices and sinful lifestyles. Even Muslim husband and wife sometimes live separate lives and share bed together. Or they have separate bathrooms. Or the wife wants to live away from elderly in-laws. Why? Independence!

But because of independence, in the West, people convert to Islam more and less fear in breaking away from their tribe/family/friends, non-practicing Muslims have fewer obstacles to become practicing Muslims, and fewer obstacles to study the deen. Also this is why Muslims in the West study different madhaib. And why so many non-Muslim academics do research and translate Islamic texts for us! So its a two-edged sword. What you want to be careful of is independence in terms of family life and religious values - khidma and teaching children to care for each other is what can be easily lost in the West because people are independent minded.


Sidenote: There is a hadith on my youtube channel about Imam Mahdi coming from the West ("Maghrib"). I can share it if you want.
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#39 [Permalink] Posted on 18th April 2020 05:28
World became global village,
Western and Eastern culture is now mixed.
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#40 [Permalink] Posted on 18th April 2020 06:33
ssaad wrote:
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Summary of the first five pages:

1. The Quran is the ultimate means of guidance.
2. Quranic revelation rectified many incorrect beliefs.
3. Western culture has given us materialism and the pursuit of pleasure.
4. The West, in their condemnation of the corrupt clergy, rebelled against religion itself.
5. There can be no contradiction between divine revelation and reason.
6. Scientific knowledge is error prone, and changes with time as the tools of science evolve. Revealed knowledge is error free and eternal.
7. The Quran is not a book of scientific facts. It is a book of revelation and guidance.
8. Muslims incorrectly assume that scientific thought and progress are gifts of Western culture.
9. The Quran encourages, rather commands, us to ponder over the magnificence of creation.
10. In its golden age, Islam gave us inventors, scientists, astronomers, medical specialists, mathematicians, logicians, historians, geographers, discoverers, philosophers, grammarians, among many others.
11. Muslims and the West clashed for centuries, but remained superior because of their faith in Allah swt and because most Muslims fulfilled their religious duties.
12. When the crusades could not defeat Islamic jihad, the West focused on acquiring secular knowledge from the centers of study in the Islamic world.
13. They then took knowledge of Islamic theology, fiqh, hadith, philosphy, Arabic, history, and under the guise of independent research academically attacked the foundations of Islam.
14. And finally, they attacked Islam by propagating aspects of their culture and fashions that ran contrary to Islam.
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#41 [Permalink] Posted on 18th April 2020 07:43
abuzayd2k wrote:
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Jazalakallahu khair brother.
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#42 [Permalink] Posted on 18th April 2020 07:54
DawudIsrael wrote:
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Brother you are discussing materialism. I would like to learn about materialism, we have read about materialism but what it is in real practice. What did materialism give and robbed from its followers. The real sufferers or who got benefited or who witnessed this can speak.
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#43 [Permalink] Posted on 18th April 2020 07:57
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There are 2 cultures west and east. We have witnessed eastern culture. Brothers who have witnessed Western culture can share their experiences.

It is not geebah because we are discussing something, one is proud of following it.
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#44 [Permalink] Posted on 18th April 2020 08:58


This was told by Ali Mian Nadvi RA decades back. But today the downfall of the western society is clearly visible.

Can our brother/sister here please translate this. There is a very important message in this quote.
magribi tahzeeb ka zawal shuroo hoegaya ali mian.j
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#45 [Permalink] Posted on 18th April 2020 09:27
DawudIsrael wrote:
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youtu.be/Z89USBg5mBs

Is this the clip Shaikh?

Very interesting?

Where did Shaikh rami Nsour study?
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