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The Truth About Silsila Naqshbandia Awaisia and Maulana Allah Yar Khan (RA)

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#76 [Permalink] Posted on 15th September 2015 15:27

Abdur Rahman ibn Awf wrote:
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His deviancy stems from his claims which have no basis and substance. If he was an excellent writer or refuter (not much evidence to suggest that he was) we are back to a Maududi type scenario.

So if Deobandees are willing to ignore Maulana Allah Yaar Khan Saheb (RA)'s primary deviancy in favour of his writing/refutation skills than lets give the same credit to Maulana Maududi (RA).

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#77 [Permalink] Posted on 15th September 2015 16:15
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Years ago on Sunniforum, there used to be a Brother called Khan Baba, he used to post refutations of various groups. But what was great about his refutations was that they were done in a neutral manner "This is it what they say and this is our response." No personal emotion, exaggerations or embellishments, or personal scores to settle,(which is a predominant trait of the brelvis,) because of the neutral manner in which they were written those refutations were highly effective. You stated the following

Man made his claims to be HIGHEST of the people of Tassawuff in his time, in writing and in speech

Man made claims that rest of Sufees are beneath him in his time, in writing and in speech

Bring Proof!


I heard a lecture were a quote of Hazrat Allah Yaar Khan (RA) was mentioned...."On the day of Qiyamah when Allah asks me, what have you brought with you, I will say Ya Allah, I have nothing to offer except these sinful eyes of mine, have done the Ziyarah of a Maqbool (accepted) servant of yours Syed Anwar Shah Kashmiri (RA) ..."

Now what you stated and the statement I heard creates a contradiction in my mind...! So were these exaggerated claims made by Hazrat Allah Yaar Khan (RA) himself. Or are these exaggerated claims ones that were made by some of his followers. Again like the Barelvis were every Peer is a Ghaus e Zaman and Junaid e Waqt.

As for Deviancy from what I can tell Hazrat Allah Yaar Khan (RA) cites the Kitab al Ibriz, now this is a work on Mystical Sufism, originating in North Africa and has been accepted by the Ulemah of Deoband, and you find Mystical Sufi Silsilahs a dime a dozen in the Maghrib and across Africa, I think Owaisi silsilah could easily be categorised as orthodox compared to some of those ultra mystical Silsilahs.




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#78 [Permalink] Posted on 15th September 2015 18:03
Abdur Rahman ibn AwJamiatulf wrote:
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Claims are mentioned by Mufti Yusuf Ludhyanwi Shaheed (RA)...Would you like for me to reproduce it for the umpteenth time?
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#79 [Permalink] Posted on 15th September 2015 20:00
Muadh_Khan wrote:
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You yourself asked my position I am giving it, I dont see any reason for you making wordplay on my name.
As for whether you should, quote Hazrat Yusuf Ludhyanwi (RA) , yes I would like to see that in reference to what is written below.

Man made his claims to be HIGHEST of the people of Tassawuff in his time, in writing and in speech

Man made claims that rest of Sufees are beneath him in his time, in writing and in speech

Bring Proof!


Whatsmore I come from a Barelvi background in that context I am not gonna follow anyone blindly "Ala Hazrat Ahmad Raza Khan has declared Deobandis Kafir and that is that..."

Fact is if you had left your critique with the Shaykh Akram Awan group and those emanating from it like our respected Brother posting on this thread , then their would have not been any issue...You decided to go full hog in your refutation, and decided to go after Hazrat Allah Yaar Khan (RA), as well. In that case then you should have been more thorough.

The Major Ahsan Baig group of Owaisis seems to have quite a few Deobandi ulemah of Bangladeshi and Indian origin associated with it, when your refutation of the Owaisis was posted on Sunniforum, this was mentioned whilst it may be difficult to make contact with those Ulemah, in the Sub-continent. A name of Deobandi Alim, in Canada was given...So it should not have been to difficult to make contact with him, ask him to respond concerning the allegations against his Silsilah...even the western media although they pay lip service to it have something called a right of response in which they contact an indvidual or group before allegations are broadcast...That would have made your refutation more thorough. Instead we had a fairly defensive response of we have comments by Hazrat Yusuf Ludhyanwi (RA) so therefore what any Aalim involved in this Silsilah, has to say is irrelevant...With all due respect the response of a Deobandi Aalim embedded in this Silsilah who was previously a Mureed of Hazrat Shaykh Ul Hadith Zakariyah (RA) , certainly would have been highly enlightening was very relevant and if he was unable to answer your questions would have given more power to your refutation...

This is were you lost me, it seemed like a golden opportunity that should have been grasped with both hands. Instead how it came across to me is Brothers who were involved in the refutation had there own agenda, and where really not interested beyond that, and some of the same Brothers who were previously offering exaggerated praises for this Silsilah.

I hope this answers your question as to my position on this issue and why.


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#80 [Permalink] Posted on 15th September 2015 21:00
Abdur Rahman ibn Awf wrote:
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Let me try writing in English again!

1) Shaykh (Mufti) Yusuf Ludhyanwi Shaheed (RA) refutes Maulana Allah Yaar Khan (RA) and his entire Tareeqa. Akram Awan etc weren't in the picture 30 years ago.

2) I didn't refute him! Quoted others.

Is that clear in plain English or would you like a longer version with headings, paragraphs and subheadings so you can follow?
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#81 [Permalink] Posted on 15th September 2015 21:20
Muadh_Khan wrote:
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No I dont think that will be necessary.

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#82 [Permalink] Posted on 15th September 2015 21:23
Abdur Rahman ibn Awf wrote:
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Good, I am glad that we are on the same page.
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#83 [Permalink] Posted on 15th September 2015 21:35
Muadh_Khan wrote:
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Well if you mean both middle aged and stubborn yes then we probably are on the same page..!
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#84 [Permalink] Posted on 16th September 2015 00:44
Brothers talking about this statement:

Man made his claims to be HIGHEST of the people of Tassawuff in his time, in writing and in speech
Man made claims that rest of Sufees are beneath him in his time, in writing and in speech

I don't understand, how this^^ is enough to call someone deviant??

Hazrat's RhA view regarding fuquha that moulana Yousuf Ludhyanwi RhA pointed out, is the only thing that is a bit deviating, as kashf and ilhaam are being given more priority, than the struggles of fuquha.

But no one can be labelled deviant just because of boasting.

So the refutation should be limited to the extent that ulama have done, and without adding more spices.
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#85 [Permalink] Posted on 16th September 2015 01:09
Abdullah1 wrote:
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Exactly.
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#86 [Permalink] Posted on 16th September 2015 10:32
Asalamukum ww. Let me mention that even if we consider hazrat maulana allah yar khan rh to be a great buzrug and his kashf was correct can we not agree that all these branches and sub-branches are mostly deviant and this shows his kashf was also prone to error. I made the effort of listening to some of the major ahsan baig group audios and it was once again the same kind of thing. Brother abdur Rahman ibn awf posted the audio of the ex-shia and Mashallah it was interesting but once again full of dreams and kashf. I listened to an audio by maulana yusuf patel who you mentioned and he was saying that there is no person like major ahsan baig in the whole world and nothing like our silsila and when he goes from this world we will never find a person like him. Now I agree all these traits are found in many sufi groups but what makes the owaisis more deviant is that this being pumped on a regular basis with devastating consquences as we can see from brother ibn Ghulam. There is a quote by maulana allah yar khan rh where he mentioned that the greatest wali of this ummah was shaykh gilani, himself and finally imam mehdi. Now with all due respect to hazrat maulana allah yar khan rh how can the respected shaykh compare to the 2 personalities mentioned above as well as the countless other auliya of the ummah. I mean the shaykh’s book dalail us sulook is his masterpiece but even that has big mistakes and does it compare to ihya uloom deen or the books of hazrat thanvi? Did maulana allah yar khan rh leave greater disciples and mureeds than maulana ashraf ali thanvi rh? Did the shaykh write any masterpieces in fiqh/hadith that can compare to awajasul masalik of hazrat shaykh zakariya rh. If one looks at the points mentioned by maulana yusuf ludiahnvi rh there are very strong points especially when the respected maulana puts down the fuqaha as well as trying to cast doubt on ijtihad and the hadith as well.
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#87 [Permalink] Posted on 16th September 2015 10:44
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Who was the Shaykh of Maulana Allah yar khan?

I'm referring to a physical shaykh he learnt from in real life, I'm hearing even this is doubtful and cannot be verified.

Says it's all really,

if we will reject an alim who doesn't have a isnad why would we accept a tasawwuf shaykh without a verifiable shajarah?? Because if it wasn't for shajarah anyone can claim anything.



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#88 [Permalink] Posted on 16th September 2015 11:15

Abdullah1 wrote:
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Abdur Rahman ibn Awf wrote:
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  1. Have both of you thoroughly read what Shaykh (Mufti) Yusuf Ludhyanwi Shaheed (RA) actually wrote on the topic?
  2. Have you also consulted Ulama in Pakistan about their opinion.
  3. Have you consulted any other Mashaykh (specifically) on the topic of Shaykh (Maulana) Allah Yaar Khan Saheb (RA)?

Jzk

 

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#89 [Permalink] Posted on 16th September 2015 12:07

Muadh_Khan wrote:
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I only read that you posted in the other thread of refutation. If that is all, then it is unjustified to call him deviant. You need solid proofs, can't call anyone deviant on mere mistakes.

If you have some more concrete proofs, please share with us.

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#90 [Permalink] Posted on 16th September 2015 12:09
Maulana Allah Yar Khan's views regarding kashf and tassawuf were definitely faulty, so was dalial us sulook. And the ulema of Deoband are unanimous on the deviancy of Maulana Allah Yar Khan and owaisi silsila.

Also, this noone has seen the silsila and some of the mureeds closely. They make be sincere, but their actions are dodgy. Maulana Allah Yar Khan (RA) was a deobandi and an aalim, but today's lot of akram awan and co are very dodgy and fishy.

In short, when we have authentic Auliya and salaasil amongst us, why opt for dodgy people?
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