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2. To which Shaikh of Tasawwuf was Imam Shafi' iee bayt to?

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#1 [Permalink] Posted on 10th April 2013 13:37

Anyone?

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#2 [Permalink] Posted on 10th April 2013 13:39

Asslamo Allaikum,

I would like to also add that it means NOTHING but Tassawuff means Suhba of Mashaykh and Imam Abu Haneefa (RA) obviously had great Suhba (companionship). Tassawuff today is significantly different to Tassawuff of thsoe days and the Silsilas didn't even exist in the time of Imam Abu Haneefa (RA)

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#3 [Permalink] Posted on 10th April 2013 13:43

"Muadh_Khan" wrote:

Asslamo Allaikum,

I would like to also add that it means NOTHING but Tassawuff means Suhba of Mashaykh and Imam Abu Haneefa (RA) obviously had great Suhba (companionship). Tassawuff today is significantly different to Tassawuff of thsoe days and the Silsilas didn't even exist in the time of Imam Abu Haneefa (RA)

Wa alay kum as salaam.

If silsilah's didn't exists at that time, then it means there were no 'Shaikh's as such in the various tariqas, so there were only pious people he sought and kept company with.

Right?

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#4 [Permalink] Posted on 10th April 2013 13:47

"Desi tadka" wrote:

"Muadh_Khan" wrote:

Asslamo Allaikum,

I would like to also add that it means NOTHING but Tassawuff means Suhba of Mashaykh and Imam Abu Haneefa (RA) obviously had great Suhba (companionship). Tassawuff today is significantly different to Tassawuff of thsoe days and the Silsilas didn't even exist in the time of Imam Abu Haneefa (RA)

Wa alay kum as salaam.

Is silsilah's didn't exists at that time, then it means there were no 'Shaikh's as such in the various tariqas, so there were only pious people he sought and kept company with.

Right?

Yes and his teachers and Ulamah did their Tazkiyah. Its just like they did "Dawah" but never went out for 4 months, 40 days, 3 days etc.

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#5 [Permalink] Posted on 10th April 2013 13:51
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Yes and his teachers and Ulamah did their Tazkiyah. Its just like they did "Dawah" but never went out for 4 months, 40 days, 3 days etc.


Dawah & tabligh of today [Nizamuddin tarteeb) is a combination of dawah, tabligh and tazkiyah but these threads are about tazkiyah, so InshaAllah we will discuss about this.
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#6 [Permalink] Posted on 10th April 2013 13:53

"Desi tadka" wrote:
Quote:
Yes and his teachers and Ulamah did their Tazkiyah. Its just like they did "Dawah" but never went out for 4 months, 40 days, 3 days etc.
Dawah & tabligh of today [Nizamuddin tarteeb) is a combination of dawah, tabligh and tazkiyah but these threads are about tazkiyah, so InshaAllah we will discuss about this.

No its the same situation. The noble Imams didn't go 4 months and didn't make Bay't to a Shaykh in SilSila so whats the difference?

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#7 [Permalink] Posted on 10th April 2013 13:54
By these accounts, what we get is Imam e Aazam [rh] was not bayt to any Shaikh of Tasawwuf.

And yet his islah happened.

Correct to say this?
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#8 [Permalink] Posted on 10th April 2013 13:57

"Desi tadka" wrote:
By these accounts, what we get is Imam e Aazam [rh] was not bayt to any Shaikh of Tasawwuf. And yet his islah happened. Correct to say this?

He didn't go 4 months or 3 days and yet fulfilled the Amal of Dawah so any comments about that?

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#9 [Permalink] Posted on 10th April 2013 13:59
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No its the same situation. The noble Imams didn't go 4 months and didn't make Bay't to a Shaykh in SilSila so whats the difference?


I don't understand this.

1. I'm not disagreeing with the aspect that the Imam's did dawah and tabligh in their tarteeb.

2. This is about tazkiyah.
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#10 [Permalink] Posted on 10th April 2013 14:01

"Muadh_Khan" wrote:

"Desi tadka" wrote:
By these accounts, what we get is Imam e Aazam [rh] was not bayt to any Shaikh of Tasawwuf. And yet his islah happened. Correct to say this?

He didn't go 4 months or 3 days and yet fulfilled the Amal of Dawah so any comments about that?

Why is this leaning towards tabligh? Please?

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#11 [Permalink] Posted on 10th April 2013 14:10

"Desi tadka" wrote:

"Muadh_Khan" wrote:

"Desi tadka" wrote:
By these accounts, what we get is Imam e Aazam [rh] was not bayt to any Shaikh of Tasawwuf. And yet his islah happened. Correct to say this?

He didn't go 4 months or 3 days and yet fulfilled the Amal of Dawah so any comments about that?

Why is this leaning towards tabligh? Please?

Because you are starting a subject to provoke people into thinking that if Imam Abu Haneefa (RA), Imam Shaf'ae (RA) weren't Bay't to someone (as recommended by Sufees today) and their Islah was done then why can't they accept that Islah can be done without Ba'yt

That's unfair provocation as those involved in Tableegh, Tassawuff, Jihad etc are all from the Ulamah of Deoband and we should respect and appreciate each other and not poke holes in each other’s areas.

These are all aspects of Deen which have evolved under Mushwara and consultation by Ulamah over 1400+ years.

Tableeghi Jamaat today IS NO WAY the same Tableegh which the Sahaba (RA) or the Imams did.

Tassawuff today IS NO WAY the same Tassawuff which the Sahaba (RA) or the Imams did.

Modes of learning Islam today ARE NO WAY the same which the Sahaba (RA) or the Imams had (your usage of an internet forum is an example of that)

But all of these have evolved over 1400+ years according to needs of the people and are neither impermissible and Haram and a person should join whoever he/she thinks to be most beneficial to his/her Aakhira

If its Tableeghi Jamaat, so be it.

If its Tassawuff Jamaat, so be it.

If its Internet Jamaat, so be it.

If its Darul-uloom Jamaat, so be it.

As long as the matter is being done after consultation with Ulamah and under their guidence.

Those who criticise Tableeghi Jamaat are wrong.

Those who criticise Tassawuff Jamaat in the same way are also wrong.

 

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#12 [Permalink] Posted on 10th April 2013 14:33
Quote:
Because you are starting a subject to provoke people into thinking that if Imam Abu Haneefa (RA), Imam Shaf'ae (RA) weren't Bay't to someone (as recommended by Sufees today) and their Islah was done then why can't they accept that Islah can be done without Ba'yt

That's unfair provocation as those involved in Tableegh, Tassawuff, Jihad etc are all from the Ulamah of Deoband and we should respect and appreciate each other and not poke holes in each other's areas.

These are all aspects of Deen which have evolved under Mushwara and consultation by Ulamah over 1400+ years.

Tableeghi Jamaat today IS NO WAY the same Tableegh which the Sahaba (RA) or the Imams did.

Tassawuff today IS NO WAY the same Tassawuff which the Sahaba (RA) or the Imams did.

Modes of learning Islam today ARE NO WAY the same which the Sahaba (RA) or the Imams had (your usage of an internet forum is an example of that)

But all of these have evolved over 1400+ years according to needs of the people and are neither impermissible and Haram and a person should join whoever he/she thinks to be most beneficial to his/her Aakhira

If its Tableeghi Jamaat, so be it.

If its Tassawuff Jamaat, so be it.

If its Internet Jamaat, so be it.

If its Darul-uloom Jamaat, so be it.

As long as the matter is being done after consultation with Ulamah and under their guidence.

Those who criticise Tableeghi Jamaat are wrong.

Those who criticise Tassawuff Jamaat in the same way are also wrong.


Astaghfirullah.

Brother Muadh, take note please:

1. Mufti Kawthari asked if Imam Abu hanifa [rh] went for 3 days and 40 days? And it was assumed that he said what he said to counter the ghulow amongst the workers of tabligh that dawah and tabligh only happens in 3 and 40 days.

2. Ulamah's and Mashaiikh's say complete tazkiyah ONLY happens in tasawwuf by being bayt upon a Shaikh of tasawwuf - and:

a) is this not ghulow?

b) who's to counter this ghulow?
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#13 [Permalink] Posted on 10th April 2013 14:39

"Desi tadka" wrote:
Quote:
Because you are starting a subject to provoke people into thinking that if Imam Abu Haneefa (RA), Imam Shaf'ae (RA) weren't Bay't to someone (as recommended by Sufees today) and their Islah was done then why can't they accept that Islah can be done without Ba'yt That's unfair provocation as those involved in Tableegh, Tassawuff, Jihad etc are all from the Ulamah of Deoband and we should respect and appreciate each other and not poke holes in each other’s areas. These are all aspects of Deen which have evolved under Mushwara and consultation by Ulamah over 1400+ years. Tableeghi Jamaat today IS NO WAY the same Tableegh which the Sahaba (RA) or the Imams did. Tassawuff today IS NO WAY the same Tassawuff which the Sahaba (RA) or the Imams did. Modes of learning Islam today ARE NO WAY the same which the Sahaba (RA) or the Imams had (your usage of an internet forum is an example of that) But all of these have evolved over 1400+ years according to needs of the people and are neither impermissible and Haram and a person should join whoever he/she thinks to be most beneficial to his/her Aakhira If its Tableeghi Jamaat, so be it. If its Tassawuff Jamaat, so be it. If its Internet Jamaat, so be it. If its Darul-uloom Jamaat, so be it. As long as the matter is being done after consultation with Ulamah and under their guidence. Those who criticise Tableeghi Jamaat are wrong. Those who criticise Tassawuff Jamaat in the same way are also wrong.
Astaghfirullah. Brother Muadh, take note please: 1. Mufti Kawthari asked if Imam Abu hanifa [rh] went for 3 days and 40 days? And it was assumed that he said what he said to counter the ghulow amongst the workers of tabligh that dawah and tabligh only happens in 3 and 40 days. 2. Ulamah's and Mashaiikh's say complete tazkiyah ONLY happens in tasawwuf by being bayt upon a Shaikh of tasawwuf - and: a) is this not ghulow? b) who's to counter this ghulow?

Already done.

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#14 [Permalink] Posted on 10th April 2013 14:40
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Because you are starting a subject to provoke people into thinking that if Imam Abu Haneefa (RA), Imam Shaf'ae (RA) weren't Bay't to someone (as recommended by Sufees today) and their Islah was done then why can't they accept that Islah can be done without Ba'yt

That's unfair provocation as those involved in Tableegh, Tassawuff, Jihad etc are all from the Ulamah of Deoband and we should respect and appreciate each other and not poke holes in each other's areas.


If Ulamah's say complete tazkiyah happens only by being bayt upon a Shaikh of Tasawwuf - is this not full on ghulow?

because Allah as maulana sa'eed ahmed khan saheb [rh] says: "Self reformation lies only in the power of Allah'

Then in the times of Imam e Aazam and now via tabligh, Allah has reformed millions [I can't say what complete and what ain't].
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#15 [Permalink] Posted on 10th April 2013 14:41

"Desi tadka" wrote:
Quote:
Because you are starting a subject to provoke people into thinking that if Imam Abu Haneefa (RA), Imam Shaf'ae (RA) weren't Bay't to someone (as recommended by Sufees today) and their Islah was done then why can't they accept that Islah can be done without Ba'yt That's unfair provocation as those involved in Tableegh, Tassawuff, Jihad etc are all from the Ulamah of Deoband and we should respect and appreciate each other and not poke holes in each other’s areas.
If Ulamah's say complete tazkiyah happens only by being bayt upon a Shaikh of Tasawwuf - is this not full on ghulow? because Allah as maulana sa'eed ahmed khan saheb [rh] says: "Self reformation lies only in the power of Allah' Then in the times of Imam e Aazam and now via tabligh, Allah has reformed millions [I can't say what complete and what ain't].

Which "Ulamah" say this?

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