Islamic Dates and the Moon

Asslamo Allaikum,

As long as you understand you simple facts:

1. Moon can't be seen if its not there
2. You are supposed to be doing Taqleed of Madhab of Imam Abu Haneefa (RA) and not individuals and the argument you are making Salafees, Barelwees, Ahl-e-Hadeeth say the same thing i.e. we are following Ulamah so you are following "your Ulamah" over a Madhab and they are following "their Ulamah" over a Madhab

Your distress is a result of direct conflict between your heart and mind as if you are reading these simple statements then you know that "there is a problem!"

I spoke to Shaykh (Mufti) Zubair Dudha (HA) yesterday and he clearly said, "There is no chance of Eid being on Tuesday (30 AUG 2011) and if there was even a remote chance I would consider difference of opinion"

Somewhere in the past you have mentioned that you do follow Shaykh (Mufti) Zubair Dudha (HA) so again you hear a Mufti and his Fatwa and you are turning away from it along with the Fatawaa of darul-uloom Deoband and most major institues.

You listen to a Shaykh (Mufti) Zubair Dudha (HA) in everything else and you ignore him on this issue.

You listen to a Darul-uloom Deoband in everything else and you ignore him on this issue.

You listen to a Shaykh (Mufti) Ebrahim Desai (HA) in everything else and you ignore him on this issue.

You can call it whatever you like but it isn't Taqleed in anyone's definition

You are not alone there are hunderds up and down the country who are distreesed because deep down you all know that "there is a problem!"

This question was put on Sunniforum a couple of years ago and appreciaed by the Ameer of SF (Mufti Hussain of SA who laughed) but I have not been able to find a British Alim who proposes following Saudia to answer as to which Taqleed and which principle of which Madhab applies here!

With due respect I would like an Academic answer from any of the Ulama who propose following Saudia for UK as to how this matter has been arrived and based on which Madhab?

Jam-e-Ghafeer: Means a large group of Jamaat of people. In the Hanafi Madhab if the sky is clear and only 1-2 people testify then such a testimony is rejected BECAUSE it is not possible for sky to be clear and only 1-2 people to sight the moon!

I would like to present two possibilities to the respected Ulama-e-Kiraam & Mashaykh. I had the same discussion with another Alim and no answer was given.

    Hanafi Madhab:

1. Global moon Sighting is accepted
2. Sighting on clear horizons must be done by Jam-e-Ghafeer and all other conditions fulfilled

    Hanbali Madhab:

1. Global moon Sighting is not acceptable
2. Sighting of 1-2 people is accepted

So in case of following Saudia for UK why are we taking:

• Global Sighting principle from the Hanafi Madhab but abandoning the sighting of Jam-e-Ghafeer?
• Accpeting the sighting of 1-2 people from Hanbali Madhab but abandoning the principle that global sighting is not acceptable?

In case of Wifaqul-Ulama following Morocco or SA both conditions of Hanafi Madhab are being fulfilled:

• Jam-e-Ghafeer are sighting the moon and testifying
• Sighting outside of UK (i.e. global) is being accepted.

As a laymen we are advised to do Taqleed so what sort of Taqleed is this? Please understand that I am not an Alim so I would like this explained simply as how one Usool is being taken from one Madhab and another Usool from another Madhab.

If you are accepting the Saudi sighting of 1-2 people and saying that Saudees follow Hanbali Madhab then YOU CANNOT apply that sighting to us because according to the same Hanbali Madhab and the Fatawaa of Saudi (Hanbali) Ulama it is unacceptable outside of SA.

If you are accepting the Saudi sighting and applying to UK (according to Hanafi Madhab) then please bring us Jam-e-Ghafeer to accept this Shahada in the first place?

Jazakullah Khairun

P.S: I apologise for repeating myself a few times but most people whom I have asked this question, don't get it so perhaps I am wrong and would like to be corrected.

^ Interesting. So much to say on so many levels, past and present..

Anyway, as requested (script below):

I'm gonna be controversial here:

I'm gonna put everything together and see there result.

According to the Readings, the moon will be visible in Chile, Argentina and Brazil, and with an OPTICAL AID, it will also be visible in South Africa.!!!!!

So,

 In the Hanafi Madhab if the sky is clear and many people do see the moon then the following rules will apply,
 
Hanafi Madhab:

1. Global moon Sighting is accepted
2. Sighting on clear horizons must be done by Jam-e-Ghafeer and all other conditions fulfilled

both conditions of Hanafi Madhab could be fulfilled:

• Jam-e-Ghafeer are sighting the moon and testifying
• Sighting outside of UK (i.e. global) is being accepted.

Muadh_Khan spoke to Shaykh (Mufti) Zubair Dudha (HA) a couple of days ago and he clearly said, "There is no chance of Eid being on Tuesday (30 AUG 2011) and if there was even a remote chance I would consider difference of opinion".

Well according to the above points, Eid could be on Tuesday if we have Muslim eye witnesses in the above mentioned countries as there is a high chance of visibilty.

BUT IF NO MOON IS SIGHTED, THEN SAUDI ARABIA WILL BE GOING AGAINST ALL RULES.

THE CURRENT SITUATION DICTATES THAT SAUDI ARABIA'S EID SHOULD BE DECLARED FOR WEDNESDAY.

Monday, 29 August 2011: