Why we disagree with Maulana Saad Sab DB

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#16 [Permalink] Posted on 14th December 2022 04:55

abuzayd2k wrote:

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Assalamu alaikum
1. It is still unresolved on what basis did the Mewatees insisted on Maulana Saad sab DB to lead the tableegi jamaat in 1995.

2. in 1995 it was decided that, there shall be 5 member shura, Faisal by turn, 3 days for each member. This was not new, for decades, this was followed in India for state Ameers. On death of State Ameer, he was replaced by a shoora with faisal by turn. Similarly, there was no Ameer in banglae waali masjid for 19 years from 1995 to 2014. There was no controversy by elders to insist on include me or exclude him in shoora.

3. After 2015, when world elders met in Raiwind, Hajee Abdul Wahab sahib RA was ameer of mashwarah, he instructed Molana Saad Sahib Db to add 4 more members with him in shoora and restore the policy followed in 1995-2014. Here maulana saad Sahib rejected the decision of Ameer.
He declared himself unilaterally that he is ameer of banglae waali masjid, and reversed the 5 member shura policy... "UNILATERAL DECISION". No mashwarah, no consultation with world elders.

4. Shura elders demand is...... return to 5 member shura, take decisions after mashwarah and don't impose unilateral decisions on sathees.

5. maulana Saad sahib's supporters justify chaos created by maulana saad sahib, they don't have any concrete proof from seerah or shariah to justify Maualana Saad sahib DB actions.

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#17 [Permalink] Posted on 14th December 2022 05:45

Assalaamu alaikum brothers,

I am sure at the end of the day we all wish the elders would unite again, and as laymen we would never have to waste time on things like which group to belong to, which markaz to go to, etc.

Allaah ta'ala has power to do all things.
At the very least, we can all make dua daily that He unites the elders.

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طالب

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#18 [Permalink] Posted on 14th December 2022 05:58

طالب wrote:

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True.... This chaos has affected the common tablighee on field. Our energies are being wasted.
But there are some facts which don't appear in social media. If these are realized, then we may regret and move towards reconciliation .

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#19 [Permalink] Posted on 14th December 2022 09:22

akbar703 wrote:

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Darul Uloom Deoband has declared maulana saad as "gumrah". Haqq and gumrahiyat cannot be united.

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afzalyunus

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#20 [Permalink] Posted on 14th December 2022 09:38

afzalyunus wrote:

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The fatwah from deoband is the effect, not the cause for the present chaos that lead to akabir leaving banglae waali masjid.

The real cause was that he diluted the usools, principles of tableeg compiled over the period from mol ilyas RA to till the day he took over.

He thought that he has possession of official texts of malfoozaat of mol Yusuf Sab RA, that is enough to understand tableeg. Poor friend........ tableeg is learnt on field, by physical experiences. No amount of reading shall help to understand the usools of tableeg.

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#21 [Permalink] Posted on 14th December 2022 14:35

akbar703 wrote:

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Bismillah.

Brothers a thread was posted here by a former member and a Doctor who was attached to work of Tabligh.

He had a close relationship with Hazrat Mianjee Abdur Rahman and he also had a close relationship with Dr Nadir Ali Khan (May ALLAH have mercy upon them both).

He listed the disagreements between the Elders and Maulana Saad Sahib. With evidences and audio clips.

Here is a link to that thread.

www.muftisays.com/forums/55-members-research-group/11351-...

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#22 [Permalink] Posted on 14th December 2022 14:52

Abdur Rahman ibn Awf wrote:

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Brother, to be fair, our respected Dr76 admitted that a very close relative of his was a very senior person at Markaz Nizamuddin, and his relative continued to remain at Markaz despite all that transpired there.

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#23 [Permalink] Posted on 14th December 2022 15:06

abuzayd2k wrote:

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Bismillah.

Personally have never participated in Tabligh Jamaat. But I am sure you have read that previous thread by Dr76 and I have no reason to doubt what he stated was true.

Putting that aside the fitnah of modern age is personality worship and cult of celebrity.

We have followers of individuals who exaggerate, the piety of the ones whom they love even spread fabricated stories glorifying them. And go to the extent of brushing off or justifying their mistakes.

And on the opposite end of the spectrum. We have those who refuse to acknowledge the accomplishments, the sacrifices, and hard work in the service of the Deen. Of those whom they dislike and go to the extent of exaggerating their flaws or even fabricating them.

Years ago there was a thread about Tabligh on the now defunct Sunniforum. I was asking questions about Tabligh it’s methodologies it’s structures it’s origins. Many participating in Tabligh did not know it’s history and would get angry about being questioned.

So I did my own research All I can say is that I was amazed by the hikmah of Maulana Ilyas khandelwi( RA) in how he structured it and his humility and his desire to be unknown.And that the work should be purely for the sake of ALLAH and from what I read he made Dua to this end. It is quite extraordinary that when people mention individuals who had a great impact upon the service of Deen in the last 100 years. His name is rarely mentioned. Even more remarkable is that millions around the world have participated in Tabligh but do not know its origins and have never heard of Maulana Ilyas (RA) that is a sign of the acceptance of his Dua and his sincerity.

Usually we have splinter groups and divisions forming in most organisations during the life time of the founder, with Tabligh it is I suppose it is quite extraordinary that it took so many decades to happen.

But now some individuals have abandoned his guidance, and methodology I think khayr and barakah will no longer be there.

And ALLAH knows best.

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#24 [Permalink] Posted on 14th December 2022 15:41

abuzayd2k wrote:

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Prof Aleem sahib, Maulana mustaqeem sahib, Maulana yusuf Ceyloni and many other elders had decided long before fitna started that their janazah will leave banglae wali masjid.

In their bayans they do point out their helplessness in present situation (veiled statement).
once in weekly ijtema of Delhi city, Maulana mustaqeem sahib said "O Delhites you forced non-delhites to leave bangle wali masjid. May Allah protect us"

Brother I need two clarifications:
1. In which mashwarah majlis, it was declared that shura policy which existed from 1995 to till date is withdrawn, and henceforth Maulana Saad sahib is Ameer.
2. What unique quality did Maulana Saad sahib possessed (other akabirs didn't have) that mewatis insisted on declaring maulana saad sab as Ameer in 1995.

Please reply to above two queries.

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#25 [Permalink] Posted on 14th December 2022 15:59

Abdur Rahman ibn Awf wrote:

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It’s gallant knights riding in battles that fall
Not feeble babes, who can do naught but crawl
.
Girte hain sheh-sawaar hi maidaan-e-jaNg mein
woh tifl kya gire ga jo ghuTnoN ke bal chale

1. We have to go back to the worst environment prevailed during the period when Maulana Ilyas sahib RA was guided towards this tahreek. Today, ummah is witnesses the results of this noble work.

2. We have to analyze disaster faced by countries where tableeg could not reach....... Panama, Venezuela, brazil, chile etc. Here large number of Arabs migrated, none exists. Official figure is 1.8 Millions in one single country.

3. We have to analyze positive results in countries where a similar disaster was waiting to happen, alhamdulillah tableegh reached. Hafiz Patel sahib once took jamaat to west indies, here a lady was leading jumah salah for men. Thousands such reports.

In India,
1. our own city, from our childhood days to till now,
2. places where we visited in jamaath.....
we have reports of pre-tabligh period and the present.
We had witnessed the worst..... today alhamdulillah there is visible change. We also get reports from places where entry of tablighis is prohibited....

Our humble request is.... active sathees in tabligh need some concessions for their deviations. Concession of ignoring their mistakes; weighing both positives and negatives.

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#26 [Permalink] Posted on 14th December 2022 16:02

abuzayd2k wrote:

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What were the disagreements between:
1. Maulana Ehtishamul Hasan RA when the issue of succession arose at the death of Maulana Ilyas RA.
2. Maulana Rahmatullah Madrasi RA and Janab Fareeduddin Aligarhi RA when the issue of succession arose at the death of Maulana Yusuf RA.
3. There was friction with even Maulana Ubaidullah Balyawi RA in connection with issues of succession.

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#27 [Permalink] Posted on 14th December 2022 20:07

akbar703 wrote:

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I am not sure what you mean by concessions. If it is regular people doing dawah then we do not judge them if what they are doing is away from the limelight. We advise them We pray for their guidance and ask ALLAH to increase them.

When the ones making mistakes are famous and celebrity speakers. Then if they fall they do not fall alone. But their followers and fans also end up emulating them because they consider them role models. I am not just talking about those in Tabligh but individuals who are famous and celebrity Islamic Speakers in general it has become a major issue here in the western countries. And now the eastern countries are not immune.

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#28 [Permalink] Posted on 14th December 2022 22:15

Bismillah

The following was posted by a Brother from Hyderabad. Many years ago on one of the forums. He mentioned that one of the speakers in Tabligh became so famous and popular that the elders stopped him from giving speeches. For close to 10 years or so. At that time personally I did fully understand this. Now many years later seeing the problems of celebrity speakers here in the west. I realise there is great wisdom in this.

Maulana Abed Khan Sahab :

By Abdul Quddus

He went to banglay wali masjid (markaz Delhi,India), he was sitting there when Moulana Yousuf رحمة الله عليه called him and grasped him. The words said by Abed Khan sahab are recorded till today by many elders, he said “ Amir, I have come here for the cause of Allah, I have come here to work for islam, give me permission from today I will not go to my home”. His age when he spoke like this was only 16 years (may Allah give barakath in his life).I heard one of elders saying about him “ A boy tied Kaffan (cloth in which a dead body is kept) on his head at the age of 16, to die spreading Islam”.

Allah has given him such a blessing lakhs of people changed their lifes form his nasihath(good words). At present his age is around 60 years (may Allah give barakath in his life). His mother was so pious that once she forgot her shoe in drawing room, some people came to see Abed khan sahab, when they went away his mother was crying inside, he asked mother why are you crying ? she answered that a namaharam(one who is not a immediate relation to a women) has seen my shoe. Today also there are some women who take this much care about their veil, so they are blessed with such children who change the world.

People of India especially people of Hyderabad like Abed khan very much, his way of speaking is distinguished from others, even the people who dont like tabligh (not knowing the truth behind it) call Abed khan sahab for speeches in their religious gathering. Because he never talk showing others mistakes.

He was so much overwhelmed by people that elders of tabligh had to stop him from speeches and public gathering for about 8 or 10 years. Because people were getting influenced by his personality and getting attracted towards him. And the work of tabligh is to call towards Allah and his prophet Mohammed (s.a.s), and not towards any person or any group.

Now he his above 60 years and ill (may Allah give barakath in his life), he cant even sit properly, but he did not forget the promise he has made at the age of sixteen. He still call people towards islam and people who don’t like to do tabligh also cannot stop crying in his speech.As soon as he completes the speech bodyguards surround him now as he is old and ill and people just run towards him. Even if president of India comes there will not be so rush. But the people who work for Allah, Allah gives them such position in this world and inshallah in the hereafter that just people see their status by opening their mouth.

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#29 [Permalink] Posted on 15th December 2022 00:24

akbar703 wrote:

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(1) Brother, to the best of my knowledge, there is disagreement about why the shura was formed during the time of Maulana Inamul Hasan RA. Markaz members tell me that the shura was formed to select an Ameer, but circumstances were such that an Ameer could not be decided upon at the time, while Shura members tell me it was formed as the apex decision making body in place of a permanent Ameer. Each side has given testimony that their version is the authentic version. I leave the matter to each one's understanding.

(2) People of mewat have always insisted that direct descendants of Maulana Ilyas RA should lead, which is why they insisted on Maulana Haroon RA earlier, too. One of the deciding factors for appointing Maulana Yusuf RA to lead at such a young age was that the people of Mewat would easily rally around him. Maulana Ilyas RA himself named five people who he considered fit to lead, and even favoured Haji Maqbool RA over the others, but ahle ilm and ahle zikr who supported Tabligh (Shah Raipuri RA and Hazrat Shaykh RA) made the final call to appoint Maulana Yusuf RA. This led to the departure of some people at the top.

Brother, please excuse me from further questions you may have regarding these details. I am not the most learned in these matters and I fear I may misrepresent facts due to my limited intelligence.

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#30 [Permalink] Posted on 15th December 2022 00:53

abuzayd2k wrote:

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All respect to you brother. I was exactly at the same place where you were 4 years ago. I was a supporter of Maulana Saad and this is what they told me. I believed that it was a two-sided argument but having a single Ameer is the Sunnah.

However, I uncovered the truth myself and I have written a complete history of Tabligh here in my website=> https://tablighi-jamaat.com

It is not a two-sided argument but a single man's action that has caused the biggest fitna to the Ummah. I had a shift in paradigm in which I simply cannot give him any momentum anymore. I have written an article on this (which seems to be the most-read article on my website) => https://tablighi-jamaat.com/maulana-saads-treacherous-violation-1995-agreement/

Now regarding your questions
(1) The shura was formed 2 years before Hadraji passed away. Keyword: 2 years prior! It was never solely made to select an Ameer but to help Hadraji. This was the lie that I was told. If it was to select an Amir, why did it not select one and decided to form a Shura in 1995 in which all shura members signed and agreed upon?

(2) The elders did not leave the Markaz due to the 2015 disagreement. They left the markaz in 2016 after the brutal manhandling. This is the first time ever the Markaz was closed for a week. So it was more of a safety issue rather than not being happy with Maulana Saad's decision.

I ask you to ask Allah and do Istikhara so that Allah SWT reveal you the truth. I have done so and alhamdulillah Allah SWT showed me the truth.

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Why we disagree with Maulana Saad Sab DB

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