Some people argue that management of the masjid should stay in the family of the 'founders' of the masjid. Is there a basis for that thinking and is such a stipulation valid ? I asked the question here www.muftisays.com/forums/14-peoples-say/10109-updated.htm... , please respond if you have the answer. jazakallaahu khairan
Brother concerned I can tell you clearly that most gujrati masjids in the UK are like this. The bharuchis have their own masjids and surtis their own. I myself am unhappy with a lot of things but in the case of my local area I can clearly tell you that the local gujrati masjid I am part of is head and shoulders above everybody else. The local bengali masjids that I know are family affairs with the one closest to me doing absolutely nothing with the imam doing a tafsir which I could probably do a better job using the limited resources that I have and reading from riyad us saliheen using a salafi darus salam commentary. They also object to us reading from fazaail e amaal until everybody has finished sunanhs which is very impractical but it is hard to reason with old people. I don't really know a pakistani masjid as such but there are 2 that come to mind. One is a brelvi one that is dead except when there is milaad or something political. The other one is the infamous tawhid masjid which I think was more multicultural but still family used to take precedence that is why the shuaib hasan family had it for so long and usama hasan was allowed to lead despite his kufr. views. So all in all there is a lot of room for improvement but I think the gujrati masjid is going the right way inshallah.
I am in agreement with you that there are major issues all over the place. I used to live in an arab country. My local masjid in the arab country had zero activities. The imam would read daily from a hadeeth book but zero other activities happeneing. So although there are a lot of issues we should be grateful for what we have. We should work on any positive changes we can make. If one finds no avenue then at least try to join the tablighi brothers on weekly ghust.
I want to know brother concerned how we can tackle these issues. We know there are problems but how do we tackle it??? That is the question.
Well before we solve the problem we have to find out if there is a problem with the current restrictions. If people including the ulama do not have an issue with such restrictions as to who can become memebers then there is no problem to solve and everything can just continue like normal. On the other hand,If they do realize something is wrong then we can start with educating others on why it is wrong.
The Ulama are the problem in UK. They can easily chose to take a moral and ethical stance against these matters but they don't.
Classic example is Bolton where a Deobandi Masjid split from another a few years ago. The (Gujrati) Ulama & Mashaykh are influential and powerful enough to either quash this split OR to bring the 2 groups together; instead they chose to do nothing but participate in both Masjids which gave legitimacy to both places of worship so now (Muslims) have a sort of Tory/Labour split in Bolton.
In Walsall Masjid Farooq is given legitimacy by Gujrtai Ulama (Bury & Leicester) and (right across the street) the Paksitani Masjid is given legitimacy by Pakistani Ulama which has made it second home of Shaykh (Mufti) Taqi Usmani (HA) in UK who knows nothing about this split.
I have read examples from the lives of our Akabir like Shaykh (Maulana) Hussain Ahmed Madani (RA) who actually very hard to resolve these (conflicts), our Akabir cancelled their programs, delayed their stay, changed their (spiritual tours) our British Ulama simply wash their hands and blame the committees (when they in fact back these committees by doing programs in these Mosques).
Masjid Farooq (Walsall) Masjid has explicitly outlawed Pakistanees in their constitution and YET Ulama like Shaykh (Maulana) Saleem Dhorat Saheb (HA), Shaykh (Maulana) Bilala Saheb (HA) and many others continue to participate in their programs while FULLY AWARE of the situation on the ground.
There are clear leadership fights (and splits) between Pakistan and Gujrati Ulama in UK and (both together) have for years discriminated against Bangladeshi community and their Ulama; in fact Bangali (Deobandees) don’t really exist!
This has NOTHING to do with Education, its about Ego, Pride and Arrogance.
Some people argue that management of the masjid should stay in the family of the 'founders' of the masjid. Is there a basis for that thinking and is such a stipulation valid
The reason/evidence used by such people could be that the key holder of the Kabah remains in the family as mentioned in the Hadith.
However, I doubt these people would even have the intellect to even use this as evidence. For most, it's a business.
Actually that was the reason given. So I would like to know if the family that has the keys to the kabah has full control over all of the affairs of the kabah, or does the caliph have a say in matters concerning it. I also asked the question as to whether such a conditions Can be stipulated regarding a Masjid. If these points are evidence in favor of what is currently happening and is a valid opinion according to ulama then I would change my point of view regarding limiting membership to a certain nationality or culture. If Maulana Abu hajerah can shed some light on these points that would be appreciated. If the Ulama(not those online) had just explained their point of view to me instead of basically saying shut up you ignorant layman how dare you question a Maulna's opinion let the ulama handle these matters then i would not have to come here for the answers.
The Keys to the Ka'bah is one thing. The family hold onto this due to the Hadith of Rasulullah and everyone fears it's possession due to the wordings of the Hadith.
But the Haramain are not run by this family at all, it is run by the Saudi regime.
Regular mosque management can't really use this as evidence as this is The Ka'bah we are talking about, not a Gujarati thing :) Khair, wallahu alum.
Concerned wrote:
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Who would really want to be the trustee of the House of Allah? Can you imagine the title and Imaan of such people. In this day and age with all the fitnah, someone has to take up the responsibility and if they are doing a good job about it, Alhumdulillah. if they aren't, then they should be asked who made them the trustee of the House of Allah :)
Both ways have their advantages and disadvantages.
So actually the Masjid in question has the following stipulations:
-You must be hanafi and have the aqida and follow the teachings of the founders of ulama of deoband to be a paid general member,
-You must be Sunni Gujrati to be a committee member and to be a trustee
They were going to put sunni surti vohra as a condition, but the definition of that was unclear, and may have put some of the current members at risk of being ineligible.
OK lets just accept the view that such stipulations are not racist and acceptable .
People agree to the above stipulations, but they do not agree if we limit the membership to a few villages only. For some strange reason you can only restrict to gujratis on the whole but not specific villages. Gujratis are special.
Lets assume such restrictions are necessary to protect the Masjid and its assets from being taken over by 'outsiders' with ill intent.
However the conversation always goes to painting a whole race or ethnicity of people with one brush. Baruchis are some kind of monsters, and the baruchi darul ulooms and aalims aren't people we want to have dealings with. Black converts get vex when we dont give them money. A gujrati(surti) Maulana is different to a black Maulana , or a Pakistani Maulana. That's the reality or life!
Maulanas agree with all of the above and have no objections.
So apparently I have misunderstood the bayans of these same Maulanas because I disagree with all of the above.
I need to relearn my Islam from these Deobandi Sunni Surti vohra Maulanas (graduates from British DU and Indian DU) and try to see things through their point of view.
This cannot be undone and I am sure it will be greatly appreciated.
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and everyone fears it's possession due to the wordings of the Hadith.
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