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Beware! Tablighi Jamaat is full of Magicians

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abu mohammed, sipraomer
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#16 [Permalink] Posted on 11th January 2019 19:20
sipraomer wrote:
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The work of Dawa:

The more simple and to the point,the better....
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#17 [Permalink] Posted on 11th January 2019 19:52
Those who do the effort of dawah and tabligh cannot and should not suffer from an inferiority complex. The second we start feeling that way we will start trying to prove why dawah and tabligh is the only deeni work and it is haq and all other works are false and baatil.
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#18 [Permalink] Posted on 12th January 2019 03:26
Dawah is a garden where flowers of the deen blossom. Every institution is a flower. Don't turn it into a jungle.
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#19 [Permalink] Posted on 12th January 2019 06:29
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Not only every ‘institution’...

In the work of Dawa every ‘situation’ is a lesson and our responses are not only observed but copied,and propagated further.

Intellectual discussions don’t matter.The more we intellectualise a message,the more philosophical it becomes and the less it affects the character.

Din is spread by ‘example’..

That is what prophets did !
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#20 [Permalink] Posted on 12th January 2019 13:34
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Maulana Ilyas Rh was a Chishti Shaykh and alim, Shaykh Zakariya RH was a chisti shaykh and alim, there are fadhail of dhikr, quran and ilm in fadhail e amaal. If anyone gets affected from those fadhail and then wants to learn more of ilm or wants to join tassawuf, why can't other tablighis allow that. What is troubling their stomach?

Remove the waqiat of Aulia and fadhail of collective dhikr and fadhail of seeking knowledge from Fadhail e Amaal and Fadhail e Sadaqaat. Remove the stories of jihad of Sahaba RA from Fadhail e Amaal. Burn the Malfoozat of Maulana Ilyas Rh. Accuse all the akabireen of Tabligh for blasphemy (Naoudhubillah) because every tablighi buzurg is attached with some silsila.

No one brainwashed me for joining other efforts. I got this inspiration from fadhail e amaal and then bayans of other jayyad ulema. Now what is the problem with other TJ brothers if my mind is more towards dhikr and ilm. Graduate or do Phd in whatever effort you want to but don't declare others apostate if they like other fields of deen.

If I got benefit from tabligh but I think that I can get more benefit from other efforts then let me benefit. I am not married to tabligh. Secondly, you can do more work by allowing and respecting ex tablighis who join other efforts. Whenever a jamaat will come in their vicinity, the ex tablighis will feel happy and co operate and say that look "We came to know of deen and various efforts of deen because of tabligh. We should do nusrat of this jamaat". Then those ex tablighis will say good words about it with others. Then every person regardless of which field he/she belongs to will send his/her children to tabligh before making them join other efforts.

This will create an atmosphere of co operation. Don't focus on quantity. Focus on quality. There is a concept called division of labour. If only those people remain in tabligh who are highly passionate about it, then it will bear more fruit than those who are doing half hearted effort.

Thirdly, if you will make Tabligh some kind of sect or tribe and declare that tablighis are only allowed to graduate in tabligh then members of other jamaats will one day feel hatred for it and this will weaken and ruin this effort.
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#21 [Permalink] Posted on 12th January 2019 13:59
Alhamdulillah, I owe where I am today with my Deen to the efforts of many devoted brothers who are regularly occupied in this blessed work. However, I am not involved anymore but on a small scale only. I attend the Gasht programs on Saturday and Sundays, but don't bother to stick around for the biyaan where essentially all it's about is to encourage all to make intention for 4 months.

1) Firstly, over the years from my experience, this system has been plagued and saturated by over zealous fanatics who will slap you with their personalised fatwas if you don't conform to their understanding of Tabligh. As many brothers in this thread have testified, many Tabligh saathis are under this deluded fallacy that this is the "only" work in Deen that matters and all other forms of conveyance of the Deen is objectionable and to be dismissed with disdain as it's been polluted with western ideals. For example, one brother said attending a mosque to perform salah or where Gasht takes place with monitors that just display salah times, verses from the Qur'an and ayahs etc. is strongly discouraged because the sanctity of the mosque has been devilled with these satanic contraptions. He even insisted to attend an auditorium where 'Ulema deliver seminars is tantamount to kufr because they have abandoned the simplistic and pure ways of the Sunnah and prefer to adopt the methodologies of the Kuffar because their hearts have been corrupted with the excrete of this dunya. What's dumbfounding is this is not just from one lost brother, but an entire Jamat. I have come across such upside down views from many Jamats over the years who have visited our local mosque.

Secondly, another aspect of Tabligh I really wish would have been addressed is the usage of narrations and verses that exclusively pertain to jihaad. I remember one "heavy weight" (that's how he was referred to) saathi who had at a go at my uncle. He made the claim that his journeying to Saudi Arabia each year to perform Umrah is not of any great value because he hasn't done 4 months yet. My uncle was quite perplexed. He said going to perform Umrah is restricted "amal" (good deeds) and he needs to give exclusive time for his Iman too. In short going for Umrah will not help your Iman because that's not much of sacrifice. He said the one who goes out in the path of Allah and just sleeps gets more reward than someone who is worshipping Allah on the night of Laylatul Qadr in front of Baytullah. It is at this point when I submitted the following question to Mufti Ebrahim Desai:

askimam.org/public/question_detail/35332

Finally, the usage of blatant fabricated and extremely weak narrations even after informing some of them to exercise caution to first verify with a senior scholar. I've clashed with various saathis who will flagrantly misquote Ahadith just to get names on the tashkeel list. It's amazing how the elders have not saw fit to address these internal concerns. I agree with the Salafis that this part of Tabligh is very much a concern. Not to mention many scholars who I've discussed this issue with are in agreement with me. I've been advised to remain silent and just to do the work to the best of my capacity and ability. For this reason my involvement in this work is limited and has been adjusted in the following ways:

a) I only take part in Gasht programs on weekends. I never intend to go for 3 days, 4 days or 4 months.
b) If I do taleem at home or the mosque, the book I will use will be Riyad as-Salihin not Fazail-e-Amaal.
c) My women folk don't attend these only-for-women programs no more.

Only a fool would deny this this work is not haq in the grand of scheme of things, but it cannot be denied that it's been tainted and rooted with ghulu.

May Allah keep us all steadfast.

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#22 [Permalink] Posted on 12th January 2019 14:26
Imam Ali wrote:
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السلام عليكم و رحمة الله و بركاته

Yes, but has Mufti Desai given 4 months in the path of Allah and gives 2 and a half hours every day for local amaal?
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#23 [Permalink] Posted on 12th January 2019 15:11
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وعليكم السلام

No idea.
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#24 [Permalink] Posted on 12th January 2019 17:48
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#25 [Permalink] Posted on 12th January 2019 19:07
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السلام عليكم و رحمة الله و بركاته

Like many, I don't rely on Albani's gradations.

Besides, scholars have decreed that weak Ahadith can be quoted and acted upon if they're about fadhail, stories and regarding bits of history.

Fabrications and extremely narrations are unacceptable by unanimous plus generational consensus.

Having said that, there has been recent research carried by a contemporary Muhadith who ironed out narrations that were extremely weak even in Imam Nawawi's book. Alhamdulillah, such narrations have been marked in our versions of Riyad as-Salihin.
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#26 [Permalink] Posted on 12th January 2019 19:44
Even Salafi books of virtue contain many weak Hadith.
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#27 [Permalink] Posted on 12th January 2019 19:58
One issue is whether weak hadith can be used for virtues etc. There is a difference of opinion on this simply due to the fact that there is no revelation stipulating what strength of hadith can be used and how to determine its strength! So from what I know many allowed using weak hadith with certain conditions, while others like Imam Muslim and Imam Zahid Al Kawthari al Hanafi, Sh Al Albani had a different opinion.

The second issue is to do with hadith that are deemed extremely weak, and even deobandi ulama caution us not to quote them and attribute them to the Prophet Salalahu Alayhi Wasalam. I havent heard of any such hadith being in books like riyadus saliheen and Adab al mufrad, and if they do have one or two like that, then we should be made aware of them as well.
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#28 [Permalink] Posted on 1st February 2019 13:54
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Wheather it is Riayadus Saliheen, Adab Al Mufrad, Fadhail e Amal or any other hadith books let's keep in mind that the authors of these books had vast knowledge and they know better than us that the included weak hadith can be practised upon or not

So I feel there is no need to make everyone aware of those weak hadith.
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