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#1 [Permalink] Posted on 26th January 2015 12:59
Since HFA (Halal Food Authority) have changed their slaughter policy from mechanical slaughtering to "Stun-to-Stun" or "hand slaughter" method only and the fact that KFC only accept "stun-to-stun", many Muslims have now been eating at KFC more regularly and their branches are now filling with Muslim consumers, whereas, before it wasn't like that.

I'm assuming that since Freeman's stun-to-stun chicken is/was certified halal by Mufti Yusuf Sacha, everyone is naturally assuming stunned chicken to be permitted.

Also a point to note is that HFA do not monitor any restaurant except for KFC, in other words, any place certified by HFA is not actually monitored by HFA with the exception of KFC.


So the question here is, "Does anyone know of any reputable Ulama who can give testimony to their methods of stun-to-stun or have declared KFC as Halal in the UK?"
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#2 [Permalink] Posted on 26th January 2015 13:35
halalfoodauthority.com/announcements/kfc-supports-hand-sl...



HFA wrote:
Following the Halal Food Authority (HFA)’s decision to abandon mechanical slaughter (press release dated December 2nd 2013), we would like to make clear what this means for halal KFC outlets (of which we have been certifying for the last five years).

KFC UK and Ireland are in support of the HFA’s recent policy change and are committed to providing their consumers with halal poultry in their halal-certified stores. HFA’s abandonment of mechanical slaughter will come into play from 3rd March 2014; suppliers to KFC UK and Ireland will follow the hand-slaughter of poultry only from this date, however, due to the multitude of chicken sourced by KFC, a mixture of hand and mechanical slaughtered poultry will be served in their halal outlets as they go through a transitional period before full compliance; from March 3rd2014 KFC will not source any mechanically slaughtered poultry from suppliers but stock bought prior to this date will be used. This transitional period will be complete by May 1st 2014.

Every slaughter site distributing poultry to KFC UK and Ireland has and will be audited by the HFA to ensure full compliance with our regulations.

HFA are issuing this statement so that the community can make their own well-informed decisions on this matter; and a copy of KFC’s statement in regards to this matter can be found here (Link currently not showing any update)
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#3 [Permalink] Posted on 26th January 2015 13:43


With prices like these, you can imagine why people will prefer KFC/HFA over HMC
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#4 [Permalink] Posted on 26th January 2015 15:19
Muslim Fastfood Chains like Dixy fried Chicken, Chicken.com Chicken Cottage etc. Have been giving KFC a hammering in the U.K probably the reason why they wanna go 'Halal'. Ironically the extreme right wing groups by campaigning against the likes of KFC and Pizza express for selling 'Halal' are helping the Muslim businesses.

Years ago Stunned meat was completely Shunned by Muslims, but it seems Muslims dont care too much and anything goes, even if a non-muslim merely puts a sign up saying meat is Halal on his premises muslims start queuing up not bothering to verify.
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#5 [Permalink] Posted on 31st January 2015 15:42
Lol, no one wants to take responsibility and rightly so.

You guys in the UK keep eating KFC without really wanting to find out the truth, so sad. I bet the KFC eaters use the classic, "Just say Bismillah man"

Anyways, anyone else had KFC? I did but not in the UK, only abroad where the chicken was locally slaughtered. Yep, I asked for proof and they showed me the package lol.
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#6 [Permalink] Posted on 12th February 2016 11:52
Can We Eat KFC?
Can anyone give references from scholars of our school that can confirm that it is now permitted to eat HFA slaughtered chicken, especially KFC. please don't base your answer on previous HFA rulings, things have changed. also don't base your answer on eating in takeaways or not.

It's simple, which scholars now accept HFA?
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#7 [Permalink] Posted on 12th February 2016 12:02
uk chicken wrote:
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I'm not a scholar but here is what HFA are saying on KFC.


halalfoodauthority.com/announcements/kfc-supports-hand-sl...
HFA wrote:
Following the Halal Food Authority (HFA)’s decision to abandon mechanical slaughter (press release dated December 2nd 2013), we would like to make clear what this means for halal KFC outlets (of which we have been certifying for the last five years).

KFC UK and Ireland are in support of the HFA’s recent policy change and are committed to providing their consumers with halal poultry in their halal-certified stores. HFA’s abandonment of mechanical slaughter will come into play from 3rd March 2014; suppliers to KFC UK and Ireland will follow the hand-slaughter of poultry only from this date, however, due to the multitude of chicken sourced by KFC, a mixture of hand and mechanical slaughtered poultry will be served in their halal outlets as they go through a transitional period before full compliance; from March 3rd2014 KFC will not source any mechanically slaughtered poultry from suppliers but stock bought prior to this date will be used. This transitional period will be complete by May 1st 2014.

Every slaughter site distributing poultry to KFC UK and Ireland has and will be audited by the HFA to ensure full compliance with our regulations.

HFA are issuing this statement so that the community can make their own well-informed decisions on this matter; and a copy of KFC’s statement in regards to this matter can be found here[/quote]

But what is HFA's definition of Halal?
[quote]DEFINITION OF HALAL
The word ‘halal’ literally means permissible- and in translation it is usually used as lawful.

The Halal food Authority rules for halal are based on Islamic Shari’ah. The antonym to halal is haram, which means unlawful or forbidden.

It is well known in the meat trade that Muslims consume halal meat. However, at times questions are asked, what is halal? In Arabic it simply means permissible or allowed. Opposite to it is haram, which means forbidden or not allowed. Arabic is the language of the Qur`an, a scripture revealed to the Holy Prophet of Islam by the Almighty Allah to be followed in its entirety by the Muslims.

Now to make meat halal or permissible, an animal or poultry has to be slaughtered in a ritual way known as Zibah or Zabihah. To make it readily comprehended halal is somewhat like Jewish kosher and, Zibah is with some exception similar to Shechita. The Qur`an gives following underlined injunctions in chapter al-Maida 5:3 that

Zabihah require animals to be alive and healthy at the time of slaughter, since carrion is forbidden and, jugular vein, carotid artery and windpipe have to be severed by a razor sharp knife by a single swipe, to incur as less a pain as possible. Here the only difference is that a rabbi will read what is required by his faith and, a Muslim will recite tasmiya or shahada, which fulfils the requirement of dedication. The question of how to overcome the issue of recitation of shahada on individual bird whence we now have poultry being slaughtered at a rate of six to nine thousand per hour, has already been addressed. A Muslim is commanded to commence all his deeds in the name of Allah.

All the flowing blood (al- An`am 6:145) must be drained out of the carcass, as blood is forbidden
Swine flesh is also forbidden, and it is repeated in few other places in the Qur`an
Forbidden is an animal that has been killed by strangling or by a violent blow, or by a headlong fall
What now becomes abundantly clear for halal purposes is that:

An animal should not be dead prior to slaughter
A Muslim should perform slaughter
Any flowing blood of the carcass should be completely drained
Choice of modern and in vogue method has to be considered with caution and, it should be in line with Islamic principles.

Since pork is forbidden, halal slaughtering must not be done where pigs are slaughtered or in the vicinity of pigs slaughtering area. There are a few more edicts and rules that have to be followed in the interest of animal welfare. For example, animal has to be fed as normal and given water prior to slaughter, one animal must not see the other being slaughtered, knife should be four times the size of the neck and razor sharp, and as far as possible the slaughterer and the animal should face the Qibla or Mecca and the animal must not be suffering from any ailments or any lacerations.
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#8 [Permalink] Posted on 12th February 2016 12:15
Abdur Rahman ibn Awf wrote:
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Quote:
Years ago Stunned meat was completely Shunned by Muslims...


prior to that, for many years muslims ate stunned chickens without even knowing any different. then mufti sacha came along and educated the UK muslims on stunned chickens. so there was a mini revolution and many muslims stopped eating stunned and sought out non stunned.

but now it seems mufti sacha is ok with stunned chickens as long as the chickens do not die due to the stunning.

so for arguments sake, if HFA can guarantee that their chickens do not die due to the stunning process, and that the rest of the zabiha process is done properly, then...

1. why are mufti sacha's chickens 'more' halal than hfa's chickens?

or

2. why are hfa's chickens 'more' haram than mufti sacha's chickens?

is it simply because mufti sacha is a gujarati deobandi?
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#9 [Permalink] Posted on 12th February 2016 12:49
The safest meat to consume is the one which is non-stunned. In Muslim countries there was (traditionally) no stunning so Ulama ruled that stunning is frowned upon.

The original stunning voltages were high and science was evolving and there was danger of animals actually dying.

Today (due to pressure of animal rights organizations) voltages are REDUCED and STUDIES conclude that Chickens CANNOT DIE (in UK).

Therefore Fatwa has changed.

Those who follow Ulama like Shaykh (Mufti) A. S. Desai (HA) quote 70 year old Fatwaas when stunning was rudimentary and in its infancy. Mufti Yusuf Sacha (HA) has looked at stunning, contacted experts, read studies and concluded that it is (IN UK) safe to assume that Chickens CANNOT DIE.

This is the difference, any scientific method evolves and changes....It is not fair to quote Fatwaas from 1920 in 2016 e.g. some Ulama still rule that Prayer with Microphones is invalid (which was the original Fatwa), today we have a pretty good idea about sound waves and how the Technology works.

Original Fatwaas on dying of clothes in India was different, today we have a pretty good idea what sort of die is used and how clothes are colored.

I have communicated with the top British Scientist from Bristol university on Stunning (who advises UK Government) and its somewhere on the forum...Mufti Yusuf Sacha (HA) is of course way ahead of me.
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#10 [Permalink] Posted on 12th February 2016 13:35
Rigorous checks by experts are done, any chicken that fails to stay alive or is not slaughtered correctly is rejected say hfa. (remember, hfa has changed its position a lot after it was taken over by the son)

So that means, hfa would be safe and this also means that KFC would be safe.

Am I correct to make this assumption?

I don't have access to scholars like you do, I have to rely on reliable websites, so clarification from scholars would be much appreciated.
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#11 [Permalink] Posted on 12th February 2016 14:01
Anonymous wrote:
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what are the credentials of hfa that they can be trusted in what they say?

are they pious, mindful of salaat, truthful, mindful of general halaal and haraam, follow the sunnah etc?
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#12 [Permalink] Posted on 12th February 2016 14:10
Exactly my point. that's why I'm asking.

Quote:
Am I correct to make this assumption?

I don't have access to scholars like you do, I have to rely on reliable websites, so clarification from scholars would be much appreciated.
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#13 [Permalink] Posted on 12th February 2016 14:14
Muadh_Khan wrote:
I have communicated with the top British Scientist from Bristol university on Stunning (who advises UK Government) and its somewhere on the forum...Mufti Yusuf Sacha (HA) is of course way ahead of me.

Is this the post you are refering to? As I can't find any other post similar.
www.muftisays.com/forums/82-the-food-section/7042-stunnin...

A refresh would be great, especially the finding of Mufti Yusuf Sacha (HA) or his opinion on the current situation in this country. Something from 2016 maybe?
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#14 [Permalink] Posted on 12th February 2016 14:52
I don't know much but could someone respond to brother abu muhammad's original quote;

Quote:
The question of how to overcome the issue of recitation of shahada on individual bird whence we now have poultry being slaughtered at a rate of six to nine thousand per hour, has already been addressed


How has this been answered by HFA? Also the rate of 6-9 thousand per hour would make it highly doubtful. Does anyone have answers for this?
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#15 [Permalink] Posted on 12th February 2016 15:19
london786 wrote:
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This is why I marked it in red.

It doesn't make any sense because it would be impossible for them to meet their other "musts".

Example, they say that
Quote:
There are a few more edicts and rules that have to be followed in the interest of animal welfare. For example, animal has to be fed as normal and given water prior to slaughter, one animal must not see the other being slaughtered,

How is that possible and at the same time go through a minimum of 6000 chickens an hour.
They must have 100's of walls and 100's of slaughter men behind each wall or even veil or the chicken is blind folded. Just doesn't add up!
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