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Is Shaykh (Maulana) Tariq Jameel Shia Lover or Kaafir?

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#61 [Permalink] Posted on 29th July 2020 15:26
abuzayd2k wrote:
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Mistakes happen from anyone and can happen and will happen.

The issue is calling people "Kaafir" or "Shia lover" or "Qadiyani lover" based on mistakes and that is trait of hate filled Hazrat Worshippers.

Let us be balanced and portray mistakes as mistakes and by all means refute them as thoroughly as humanly possible but no reason to get personal.

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#62 [Permalink] Posted on 29th July 2020 15:51
Muadh_Khan wrote:
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A very sincere senior brother in our neighborhood was taken in by the social media misinformation campaign against Maulana Saad HA and he was genuinely anguished by everything he heard about Nizamuddin markaz. Mashallah now he has returned to the daily amaal of dawah and he says he was wrong to get involved in matters concerning the elders because he is doing the work for his own islah and not for the sake of the elders. I was humbled by his words.

A very senior elder of the Shura in our region also told us that whether you align yourself with one or the other group, they are both doing the same work, so follow those whom your heart is at ease with.
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#63 [Permalink] Posted on 29th July 2020 17:27
Hazrat Maulana Bilal Bawa offered a gentle criticism of Maulana Tariq Jameel during a livestream in Ramadhan.

He stated many Ulemah are displeased with some of the things that Maulana Tariq Jameel does. He gave an example of Maulana Tariq Jameel visiting a famous Shia Aalim and showering excessive praise and compliments on him. He said that a youngster who was a member of his own congregation and ardent follower of Maulana Tariq Jameel. Seeing this video of Maulana Tariq Jameel praising the Shia. Saw this as an endorsement and started watching the lectures of the Shia and became impressed by his rhetoric and charismatic speeches became very confused fortunately he did turn up to the masjid to clarify certain issues. Many others might not do so and get inluenced.

I think that is a fair critique Maulana Tariq Jameel by his nature and personality looks for something positive to say of others. And compliment them whether those people are religious personalities, politicians or celebrities. Unfortunately the Hazrat Worshippers of Maulana Tariq Jameel see this as an endorsement.

By the same token the personalities he meets use the meetings with him to their advantage and promote it as an endorsement.
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#64 [Permalink] Posted on 29th July 2020 18:02
Abdur Rahman ibn Awf wrote:
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This is classic example used by many Deobandi Ulama all the time and you hear various iterations of this all the time.

Before Afghan-Jihad it was common for Ulama from cross platforms, here is an example of Mufti Shafi Usmani (RA) on Radio Pakistan where he specifically talks about riding the same car as Shia and Barelwee Ulama.

www.youtube.com/watch?edufilter=NULL&v=tvhVxZ0opFM

I translated this in English somewhere so if someone Googles they will find it.
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#65 [Permalink] Posted on 29th July 2020 18:45
Muadh_Khan wrote:
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Or maybe the real fault is the ignorant people amongst the masses. Who have developed a weird cult of personality or what you call Hazrat Worship around Maulana Tariq Jameel.

They only listen to his lectures and no one else. And I have come across those. Who actually believe that Maulana Tariq Jamil is actually the world wide Amir Of Tabligh Jamaat. Who have never heard of akabireen in Nizamuddin or Raiwind.

The excess veneration leads to a cult like mentality. They are unable to see that Maulana Tariq Jameel is a person of Dawah and if he visits a person and or a place it is not a comprehensive endorsement but a gentle way of calling people towards the Haq. Or that he may make a speech were he misquotes something or makes a mistake. For anyone who makes hundreds of speeches will inevitably make some mistakes.

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#66 [Permalink] Posted on 29th July 2020 19:06
Abdur Rahman ibn Awf wrote:
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The weird cult is a direct result of "Hazrat Worship" being directed from the mimbar. Whatever Maulana Bilal Saheb (HA) says is always right because he is the Khaleefa of Hazrat Shaykhul-Hadeeth (RA) and no critical thinking or analysis is needed.

This sort of thinking has its pros and cons of course. The result of rejecting Ulama and absolutely relying on "one's mind" is Engineer Ali Mirza. The result of absolute Taqleed is people listening to a Shia person just because Maulana Tariq Jameel (HA) praised him.

The balance is Islam and Sunnah.

Allah Ta'ala has commanded us to make Taqleed to "Ulama" and not "Alim" but Hazrat Worship is all about making Taqleed of "Alim" at the cost of "Ulama.
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#67 [Permalink] Posted on 29th July 2020 19:16
Muadh_Khan wrote:
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Firstly I was not familiar with Maulana Bilal until April when the following thread was posted. www.muftisays.com/forums/41-speech--urdu/13300-maulana-bi...

I have not got a clue as to which Hazrat Shaykh he is Khilafah off.

But his comments on Maulana Tariq Jameel were balanced and fair.

So I dont understand what your point is you talk about Hazrat Worship regularly. Perhaps the biggest cult of Hazrat Worship I have seen is the one surrounding Maulana Tariq Jameel.

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#68 [Permalink] Posted on 29th July 2020 19:28
Abdur Rahman ibn Awf wrote:
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May be true but Maulana Tariq Jameel (HA) didn't give rise to Hazrat Worship, he may have benefited or a recipient of it.

Taqleed is following "Ulama" and not an "Alim" whoever he may be, now apply this principle from New York to Johannesburg to Islamabad and its the same underlying issue, just manifested differently in different personalities.

We are making fundamental errors in Taqleed and it is the "body of Ulama" whom we are supposed to make Taqleed of and not individual Maulana Bilal (HA) or Maulana Tariq Jameel (HA) or Maulana Saad (HA) or Peer Zulfiqar (HA) or XYZ.

This is the method of Akabir of Deoband in line with Sunnah.
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#69 [Permalink] Posted on 29th July 2020 19:31
I am not criticising Maulana Bilal Saheb (HA) here, lets be clear.
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#70 [Permalink] Posted on 29th July 2020 19:48
Abdur Rahman ibn Awf wrote:
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When Shaykh Yasir Qadhi makes a mistake or is himself confused about a certain topic, you blame him for causing doubt and confusion to the youth. But when Maulana Tariq Jameel Sahab makes a mistake you blame his followers. Is it not a double standard? Or am I missing something?
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#71 [Permalink] Posted on 29th July 2020 19:56
Muadh_Khan wrote:
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I agree with you in that the work Maulana Tariq Jameel does is essential. And many perhaps thousands have been guided by his lectures across the world. And undue and harsh criticism has been directed towards him.

But something strange with the cultish mindset of many of his followers.

When I first came across his name nearly 20 years. He did not allow photography or video recordings. His followers would look down on those who did.

With the swing and tide of the internet Maulana had to change his dawah.

As each position the position of the followers changed. Photography and videography was haram but then it no longer became haram.

A shaykh appearing on TV channels was frowned upon. Then no longer frowned upon.

A shaykh speaking infront of mix gendered audience of Academics was frowned upon. Then no longer frowned upon once Maulana started doing so.

Associating with various other religious groups and leaders such Dr Tahir Ul Qadri. Was frowned upon then that changed.

Scholars spending time with celebrities and politicians was frowned upon. But then that changed.

Scholars attending huge mixed gathering conferences was frowned upon the likes of Mufti Menk got attacked for it. That changed when Hazrat Maulana attended the huge Reviving Islamic Spirit Conference in Canada.

So this is beyond cultish.



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#72 [Permalink] Posted on 29th July 2020 20:21
bint e aisha wrote:
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What you said is one hundred percent correct. Ultimately Maulana Tariq Jameel should take into account the impact of that he has on his followers. When doing Dawah like when he visited this Shia Imam apparently many shia attended the Raiwind Ijtema started listening to his speeches. But it is counter productive if the Sunni followers you already have start going the opposite direction and start listening to the Shia Scholar and developing Shia sympathies.

But then why blame his followers?

For the simple fact that Maulana has not presented Academic or intellectual arguments that has sowed doubts in origins of the Quran and other issues.

That led to people doubting Islam altogether and leaving it.

Having said that Maulana Tariq Jameel should be aware of the impact his personal example has on his followers. And the cult that has been built around him.

As for Dr Yasir Qadhi his followers are mostly from the west do not have the same cult mentality they have been more confused. By his Academic or intellectual arguments.

Bottom line YQs followers are more intelligent. Maulanas followers are more cultish and less so, and need to be criticised.


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#73 [Permalink] Posted on 29th July 2020 20:59
Abdur Rahman ibn Awf wrote:
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Ok then you are not aware of Maulana Sahab's blunders. Fine!
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