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#1 [Permalink] Posted on 26th April 2018 20:33

www.darulifta-deoband.com/home/en/Jumuah--Eid-Prayers/3046

ASlmz w w, Alhumdolillah Mufti Saeed Ahmed Palunpuri was in London this Ramdhan and we benefitted from his as never before - he safe guarded our farz fast by explaining the whole masail of Moonsighting and i prayed my Eid salaat with him. Can you please answer 2 questions for me:- 1st Question "Here in the UK all our Deobandi edara's and most of their UK akaabereen (not all) follow Saudi in moonsighting. Must we follow them or should we not (inlight of fatwa from Deoband, Shaharanpur, Dhabel and other world fatwas) as Saudi's moon sighting is not reliable?" 2nd question Do we have to follow our elders (Respected Scholars and Muftis) of the UK if we have doubt in the sighting of the Saudi moon?

بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم

(Fatwa: 207/197=B)


There is much distance between Britain and Saudi Arabia. Instead of following such a distant country the people of Britain should follow the moon sighting of any closer country like Morocco when the moon sighting is proved by ways prescribed in Shariah.


Allah knows Best!
Darul Ifta,
Darul Uloom Deoband

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#2 [Permalink] Posted on 26th April 2018 21:39
Won't layman be excused for doing taqleed of their local scholars?
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#3 [Permalink] Posted on 26th April 2018 23:14
Sometimes even scholars don't follow the correct teachings just to stay in line with tradition.

I remember Mufti Saeed Ahmed Palanpuri talking about Dua in congregation after Salah and that there was no basis for this action, rather we should stick to the Sunnah. Did the local scholars listen? Yes, only whilst he was there, then it was back to biddah. This issue isn't just with certain types of Deobandi, i.e. we see it in Pro Hizbul and Wifaqul Ulama Masjid's.

Anyways, this topic of discarding the Sunnah of moonsighting is a sign of the commencement of the Dajjal, so I guess we'll have to live with it for a lot longer.
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#4 [Permalink] Posted on 26th April 2018 23:39

abu mohammed wrote:
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Most of the times we want a quick solution to things. To think that Hadhrat would come once and mention that leave A, B, C and the suddenly the entire nation will say Same'na Wa ata'naa is far fetched. Moving from one stance to another will need change of minds, hearts and forebarence. You will need to make the people ready for that change, so it will be gradual.

Gradual effort requires ikhlas and effort. An this is what most of us lack. We cannot have istiqamah in ourself, let alone keep it where efforts of deen are concerned. So i would not say that lack of such changes is because of rejecting our elders or their religious advices. Sometimes perhaps, but most of the time it is an indication of our lack of will to put the work in it. Allahu musta'aan

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#5 [Permalink] Posted on 26th April 2018 23:58
abu mohammed wrote:
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Last year I heard Mufti Saeed Ahmad Palanpuri mention some other interesting things which goes against the norm in my community.

1)He spoke about reading the particular durood 80 times after asr on a Friday and said it wasn't proven according to hadith

2) He confirmed that the dua on the posters to be read after taraweeh is not from hadith. Can't remember if he said we mustn't emphasize it too much.

3) He mentioned darul uloom deoband's position on limiting women's participation in tabligh to the local effort, and said they should not go out abroad in jamat.

4) He said those who have a lot of missed prayers can pray the missed prayers in place of sunnah muakada after duhr, magrhib etc.

5) He was against masjids having open days, saying it wasn't from the sunnah.


Edit :6) He said there was no need for everyone in itikaf to have their own partitioned private section. ( even when they are only a handful of people in itikaf)
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#6 [Permalink] Posted on 27th April 2018 00:08
abu mohammed wrote:
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salaam

dont forget usually it is the committee that controls the masajid and the wages of the imams. and usually the committee are jahil. if the imam doesnt tow the line then he is easily replaceable, and as their income mainly depends on their jobs as the imam and teaching in the maktab, then they can easily be manipulated for fear of losing their jobs and possibly maligned in the community. committees can be a bunch of very nasty people.
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#7 [Permalink] Posted on 27th April 2018 00:11

Concerned wrote:
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Might I also say that Mufti Sa'eed Palanpuri Saheb db. although genuine and a name on his own, does not need another to give any credibility to him, still relinquish fatwa naweesi to Darul Iftaa Deoband. He constantly says that if you want fatwa, then go and take from them and not from me. 

It is also along the same lines we also make another mistake.. Pick up his Tuhfatul alma'ee or Tuhfatul Qari and check his sharh on some hadeeth and understand that to be his fatwa position. This also should not be done.

Yes, his personal directive should be taken as his personal directives, advices and insights into the matters of time. But they should not be automatically made into the representation of Hanafi Fiqh of Darul Iftaa Deoband's stance.

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#8 [Permalink] Posted on 27th April 2018 00:11
xs11ax wrote:
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What you have said is true for some. When it suits them they say we are following the ulama and that is final, and when it doesn't suit them they follow different ulama or what pleases them.

But in my experience sometimes the committee is correct and the Imam is stubborn.
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#9 [Permalink] Posted on 27th April 2018 04:13
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I understand that his views are not necessarily the views of Darul Uloom Deoband, but he mentions his views in public question and answer session, so those in the gathering may act on his responses, regardless of if they are representative of Hanafi Fiqh or of Darul Iftaa Deoband's stance or not. And when he gives an answer it would be with the intention that the questioner acts on his response, regardless of if it is representative of Hanafi Fiqh or of Darul Iftaa Deoband's stance or not.
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#10 [Permalink] Posted on 27th April 2018 06:00

Concerned wrote:
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Yes absolutely. But that is just as any Deobandi Sheikhul Hadeeth of UK giving his advice and opinion too. Mufti Sa'eed Saheb db. will say one thing, Sh Yunus Jaunpuri r.a said another, Mufti Khanpuri something else, and then Mufti Taqi db. or Mufti Rafi db. say something else.. 

All personaly advices. When it comes to adopting a policy for one's masjid or Madrasah etc, there would be some decorum in whose advice are adopted and to what extent. Hence different flares will definitely remain. Being deobandi does not mein a unison marching of an army battalion : ).. It is being academically honest with the broader guidelines.

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#11 [Permalink] Posted on 27th April 2018 07:11
abuhajira wrote:
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Mufti Saab once said that so on so prefers Biryani whilst so on so prefers Daal Chawal, so there is space for difference of taste/opinion.

Having said that, when there are clear cut violations or biddah, then the verdict must be followed.

When he expressed his views of not making Dua after fard Salah in congregation, he said said it in front of his student who also happened to be the leading imam of the masjid and was adamant about it. Yet, even afterwards, the student/imam ignores it and continued with tradition.

Also, when it came to the day of Eid, mufti saab expressed his views and was very angry at the outcome and left the masjid to continue with Ramadhan for an extra day!

This is the reality of Deobandi vs Deobandi
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#12 [Permalink] Posted on 27th April 2018 08:05

Rajab wrote:
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Two points.

You cannot make lofty claims of being Deobandi, sing praises of Deoband, have connferences of Deoband and then turn around and unilatarelly reject the Fatwa and practise of Deoband and still call yourself Deobandi. By practise, I mean:

  1. Practise of Deobandi Ulama of India
  2. Practise of Deobandi Ulama of Pakistan
  3. Practise of Deobandi Ulama of Bangladesh
  4. Practise of Deobandi Ulama of South Africa (even)

etc. Everybody has a local system of Moonsighting

Taqleed is done of a sound position. UK has a established 12 month Moonsighting system, Saudi Arabia DOES NOT so what is a person following? Saudi Arabia does not even make an announcement for Rajab so what is being followed? You cannot follow something which doesn't exist

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#13 [Permalink] Posted on 27th April 2018 15:41

abu mohammed wrote:
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Bhai, fatwa about congregational dua after Salah is the same. It is the same fatwa Mufti Ebrahim Saheb also gave. Mufti Ishaq Moosa Saheb wrote extensively upon it. But I still recall sitting in front of Mufti Ebrahim Saheb when he specifically told me that this particular answer must not be published without a disclaimer to administrators of masajid and the respective ulama to utilize hikmah in applying the ruling. 

Not to use danda, rather a gradual soft tone of constant work to remove this habbit. Because the danda will bring about fitna and fitna is worse. 

Mufti Sa'eed Saheb is equally harsh about digital photography, which is backed by majority deobandi mashayekh throughout the deobandi fraternity. Mufti Khanpuri Saheb strong and harsh wordings against those who took his photograph are still vibrating. The fiqhi stance of making ijtima'i Qiyam al Layl is also wellknown from madhab and from our fatawa kutub, but still those who follow Hazrat Ml. Husain Madani rahimahullah do not wish to move away from their stance. These matters are not to be dealt with danda.. piyaar muhabbat se adabi aur ilmi usloob se baat ki jaye.

All the bigger Muftiyan are our elders. They have the right to lash out at us, be cross with us and at times even make a walk out. I still remember Sh Yunus Jaunpuri rh kicked out our Muhtamim Ml Madani rahimahulah out of his own car to walk to his own home. These are their usloob and ways of making islaahs in whatever capacity they feel will be better. But that does not mean that as the broader awaam we take these lashings and start delivering our own lashing to the our ulama'. Martabay aur akbariyat ka lihaaz malhooz rakhna chahiyay.

But I do agree, the strength of admonishment shows how passionate Hazrat must be in his stance. That is saying something. If I am constantly invited to location A where they do not even follow my advice, even for sake of muruwwah and feeling shy of being in my presence, then either I will stop going there, or if I feel they deserve my harsh words, I will lash out at them. I have this same policy about fahash kalami. You swear in my presence, I will leave your company or will stop associating with you. 

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