Forum Menu - Click/Swipe to open
 
Top Members

Ignorant Piety

Jump to page:

You have contributed 0.7% of this topic

Thread Tools
Appreciate
Topic Appreciation
samah, abu mohammed, queenie, Naqshband66, Muadh_Khan, dr76, the fake shaykh, BHAI1
Rank Image
Jinn's avatar
Unspecified
2,890
Brother
219
Jinn's avatar
#1 [Permalink] Posted on 6th April 2014 22:37
It is reported that Imm Muhammad ibn. Srn - Allh have mercy on him - said:

There were people who abandoned knowledge and sitting with the scholars, and [instead] took to their chambers and prayed until their skin dried [from exertion in worship]. Thereafter they began to contradict the Sunnah and thus were destroyed. By Allh, never does a person act without knowledge, except that he spoils and corrupts more than he fixes and rectifies.
Al-Asbahn, Al-Targhb wa Al-Tarhb 3:98

Knowledge is a means of unlocking all your hidden potential, if you do not seek it you will never truly excel, neither in this life or the next. Knowledge is a means of truly understanding and knowing your Lord and his beloved messenger sal-Allahu alayhi wa salam, how can you love someone who you do not know. The more we learn about Allah's favors to mankind, the more we grow closer to him and love him, likewise the more we know about the sacrifice of our beloved prophet Muhammad sal-Allahu alayhi wa salam the more we can appreciate and love him too.
report post quote code quick quote reply
+6 -0Like x 5Agree x 1Winner x 1
back to top
Rank Image
Arslan.'s avatar
Unspecified
909
Brother
39
Arslan.'s avatar
#2 [Permalink] Posted on 6th April 2014 23:14
(bism1)

And this is why we need to keep a balance between spirituality and academic knowledge. On the one hand there are people who are extremely spiritual, but lack even basic knowledge of the deen, and end up invalidating many of their 'ibaadaat. These are the ignorant people. One the other hand, there are people are very academically-inclined, they know fiqh/tafseer, they can quote to you proofs and legal rulings etc... but there hearts are dead.

Allah had given Bani Israa'il the Torah, the majority of which was laws and ahkaam. They constantly talked about fiqh, ignoring spirituality, and thus their hearts hardened. Allah gave to the Nasaara the Injeel, the majority of which was Hamd of Allah. The Nasaara focused much on praise and glorification of Allah, but became ignorant due to their abandonment of academic knowledge and ahkaam.

We (the Muslims) have received the Qur'aan, which is essentially a book of both spirituality and ahkaam/fiqh. Let us keep a balance between the two.

"A faqih and a sufi: do not be only one of them" [i.e. be both]

- Imam Ash-Shaafi'i رحمة الله عليه
report post quote code quick quote reply
+9 -0Like x 8Winner x 1
back to top
Rank Image
Coloratura's avatar
Soleil
122
Sister
146
Coloratura's avatar
#3 [Permalink] Posted on 7th April 2014 05:51
"Neglect will find no way to you except through your own negligence in following the example of the Prophet. And you will not be elevated in the sight of God except by following the example of the Prophet. Now, following his example takes two forms: outward and Inward.

"The outward form is in such matters as Prayer, fasting, alms, pilgrimage, Jihad, and the like. The inward form is that your prayer be characterized by a connection with God and your recitation of Quran by reflection upon him.

"So when you perform an act of obedience such as prayer or recitation and find neither connection nor reflection, know that you are afflicted with some inner disease, be it arrogance, conceit, or some similar malady. Indeed, God says, "I will turn away from My signs those who unjustifiably proceed with the arrogance n the land" [7:146] In such instances, you will resemble a person who is wracked with fever in whose mouth sugar acquires a bitter taste.

"But (even in this context), disobedience in a taste of humiliation and recognizing one's need for guidance is better than obedience in a state of vain gloriousness and arrogance."

( Ibn 'Ata' Allah al-Sakandari from "Taj al 'Arus")
report post quote code quick quote reply
+5 -0Like x 4Winner x 1
back to top
Rank Image
Offline
Unspecified
74
Brother
130
#4 [Permalink] Posted on 7th April 2014 23:55
Imam Malik (rahmatullahi alayh) is reported to have said:

"He who practices Tasawwuf without learning Sacred Law corrupts his faith, while he who learns Sacred Law without practicing Tasawwuf corrupts himself. Only he who combines the two proves true."

Experience from real life is a testament to this truth.
report post quote code quick quote reply
+4 -0Like x 1Agree x 1Winner x 2
back to top
Rank Image
Offline
Unspecified
1,011
Brother
814
#5 [Permalink] Posted on 8th April 2014 10:30
Deoband wrote:
View original post

ustadh abdus sakur brooks has been critical of this being attibuted to hazrat imam malik rh. Maybe you could get a reasearcher to look at this. Although it makes perfect sense as experience has shown
report post quote code quick quote reply
No post ratings
back to top
Rank Image
Muadh_Khan's avatar
Offline
UK
9,868
Brother
8,055
Muadh_Khan's avatar
#6 [Permalink] Posted on 8th April 2014 11:59

Deoband wrote:
View original post

Hazrat,

This statement cannot be ascribed to Imam Malik (RA) as per Shaykh Moulana Muhammad Abasoomer Hanafi Deobandi (HA) let alone Malikees who have long said that Imam Malik (RA) never said anything like this at all.

Jzk


Question: The one who practices At-Tasawwuf without Al-Fiqh will destroy his religion. And the one who practices Al-Fiqh without At-Tasawwuf will destroy himself. (Join between the two). Has this statement that is often credited to Imam Malik been authentically narrated back to him?

Answer: The statement is as follows:

 

من تصوف ولم يتفقه فقد تزندق ومن تفقه ولم يتصوف فقد تفسق ومن جمع بينهما فقد تحقق



“Whoever practices Sufism without jurisprudence becomes a heretic. Whoever learns jurisprudence and not Sufism becomes a sinner. Whoever gathers between them attains the truth.”

This statement has not been authentically traced back to Imām Mālik. In fact, there is appentantly no existing chain of narration for this. None of his students or those who narrated Hadith from him have reported this.

It seems this attribution to Imām Mālik did not appear until approximately seven hundred years later by Shaykh Aḥmad Zarrūq who passed away in 899 AH which he mentioned in the fourth principle of his book Qawā‘id Al-Taṣawwuf without any chain of transmission. Interestingly enough, the famous Hadith scholar Al-Murtaḍā Al-Zabīdī (1250 AH), also quoted this very statement in his commentary on Al-Ghazālī’s Iḥyā stating that “someone said…” without claiming it to be the statement of Imām Mālik or anyone else which indicates that he could not trace it back to anyone in spite of his vast knowledge concerning Hadith transmission and the different statements of the Salaf.

However, it seems that this statement is mistakenly derived from a similar statement of the Sufi Imām Abū Bakr Al-Warrāq of Balkh (280 AH) because the Hadith scholar Abū Nuʿaim Al-Iṣbahānī (430 AH) reported in his  Ḥilyah Al-Auliyāʾ (a collection of sayings and virtuous deeds of the early Muslims) with a chain of narration going back Abū Bakr al-Warrāq of Balkh that he said:
 

من اكتفى بالكلام دون الزهد تزندق  ومن اكتفى بالزهد دون الكلام والفقه ابتدع ومن اكتفى بالفقه دون الزهد والورع تفسق  ومن تفنن في هذه الأمور كلها تخلص



“Whoever suffices with asceticism without theology and jurisprudence becomes an innovator, and whoever suffices with jurisprudence without asceticism and God-fearingness will become a sinner. Whoever learns all these things saves himself.”

Thus it seems that this attribution to Imām Mālik is a mistake which apparently seems to be from Shaykh Aḥmad Zarrūq (may Allah have mercy on him).

And Allah Ta’ala knows best.

Verified by: Moulana Muhammad Abasoomer

References: Qawā‘id Al-Taṣawwuf (the fourth principle), Ḥilyah Al-Auliyāʾ of Abū Nuʿaim Al-Iṣbahānī (10/236), Al-Murtaḍā Al-Zabīdī’s  commentary on Al-Ghazālī’s Iḥyā (1/174)

report post quote code quick quote reply
+2 -0
back to top
Rank Image
Offline
Unspecified
74
Brother
130
#7 [Permalink] Posted on 9th April 2014 11:46
London and Muadh Bhai, JazakAllah Khair for this information.

That statement by Imam Abu Bakr Al-Warraq is profound.

All the Akaabir of Deoband emphasized on the indispensability of Fiqh and Tasawwuf for the correct understanding and practice of the Deen. One without the other invariably results in deviation.

Maulana Ashraf Ali Thanwi stated:

"And since we are aware that fiqh is the understanding of the Deen, what doubt can there now be that a Faqeeh is also a Soofi. All our Fuqaha, as many as they were, were all Sahib-e-Nisbat and Sahib-e-Ma'rifat (i.e. Walis who followed the Path of Tareeqat). The proper and total understanding of the Deen cannot be acquired without nisbat and ma'rifat.

This is the reason why it has been mentioned regarding the Fuqaha, "One Faqeeh is harder on shaitaan than a thousand 'aabids." The person who understands the Deen well, will be privy to the deceptions and ploys of shaitaan. He will not allow a single trick to entrap him. As for the unlearned 'aabid, shaitaan can manoeuvre and manipulate him as he pleases."
report post quote code quick quote reply
No post ratings
back to top
Rank Image
Muadh_Khan's avatar
Offline
UK
9,868
Brother
8,055
Muadh_Khan's avatar
#8 [Permalink] Posted on 9th April 2014 12:06

Deoband wrote:
View original post

That is a different subject altogether but Justice and Fairness (as a believer) demands that you retract your ascription of a statement to the great Imam and it is also inline with Islamic Shariah.

You can quote Malfoozat of later day ofcourse but the significance of it is instantly diminished (ofcourse).

Regardless of your actions, I have asked you and everyone else to show me ONE EXAMPLE of where my error has been pointed out and I have not retracted so I can correct myself.

Jazakallhu Khayran and request for duas.

report post quote code quick quote reply
+0 -1Dislike x 1Disagree x 1
back to top
Rank Image
Offline
Unspecified
74
Brother
130
#9 [Permalink] Posted on 10th April 2014 18:04
Muadh_Khan wrote:
View original post


Assalamualaykum brother,

Sorry I didn't know retraction was necessary.

I retract my statement that someone had reported that Imam Malik stated the aforementioned words.

Regarding Maulana Ashraf Ali Thanwi's profound statement, it shouldn't be too difficult to work out its relevance to this thread.

Your final point is however on a complete different subject altogether and one which I can't discuss with you unless you obtain Mufti Yasin's permission - since he has already closed this discussion and I assume he will not be willing to let it start again.

Since you're final point has remained undeleted, I'd like the opportunity to answer and end it with the following points of clarification:
  • I have not claimed anywhere that you have ever failed to retract whenever your error was pointed out.

  • In fact, in that Fatwa vs Taqwa thread I did not even claim that you had made any errors.

  • My only request was that you merely substantiate your numerous accusations and claims of incorrectness in my statements, quoting my exact words where I had committed such errors. At the end, in order to make the issue as simple as possible for you, since you kept claiming not to have understood my requests written in plain English, I narrowed it down to only ONE instance from the numerous accusations and claims for which I sought substantiation (see posts no. 157 & 160). I found it quite strange that you still professed to not to have understood what I was requesting from you.

  • Finally, I am concerned about how much leeway you are given on this forum to make similar such judgements on the beneficial statements of others who are far better than me. Whilst browsing this forum recently, I came across a few horrendous errors of yours which are bound (unintentionally hopefully) to attract ridicule upon the fatwas of a Mufti whose knowledge, Taqwa, and purity from the influences of this Naajis society, is far beyond mine's and possibly your's.

I am personally shocked at how such horrendous statements of yours (referred to in the last point above) have remained on this forum undeleted for so long. Again, I can elaborate fully and demonstrate how erroneous your judgements were on that particular issue, only if Mufti Yasin allows such a discussion to run at length to a proper conclusion.
report post quote code quick quote reply
No post ratings
back to top
Rank Image
Jinn's avatar
Unspecified
2,890
Brother
219
Jinn's avatar
#10 [Permalink] Posted on 10th April 2014 18:08
Deoband wrote:
View original post



(salam)

Can I ask you not to derail my thread please and same goes for others

You're a member of this forum now and brother Muadh is very good at replying to PM's, so akhi please use that feature

جزاك الله خيرا
report post quote code quick quote reply
+1 -0Like x 1Agree x 1
back to top
Rank Image
Offline
Unspecified
74
Brother
130
#11 [Permalink] Posted on 10th April 2014 18:44
Jinn wrote:
View original post


The derailment was caused over a day ago in the post before mine's, but I am the one that gets directly addressed!

You need not worry as I have stated explicitly that since his statement causing derailment was not deleted, I would like to answer and END IT with a clarification.

Any further discussion, pending the admin's permission, will be in another thread and in public, since his abominable 'analysis' of another Mufti's fatwas have remained on this forum for public consumption and derision for so long.

In other words, I am now vacating your thread.
report post quote code quick quote reply
No post ratings
back to top
#12 [Permalink] Posted on 10th April 2014 19:17
Jinn wrote:
View original post


Why is it derailed when Deoband replies, but not when Muadh replies? It took you less than 5 minutes to reply to Deoband's "derailment" but no word of a derailment for Muadh?
report post quote code quick quote reply
+0 -0Like x 1
back to top
Rank Image
Taalibah's avatar
Unspecified
7,107
Sister
5,408
Taalibah's avatar
#13 [Permalink] Posted on 10th April 2014 19:40
السلام عليكم و رحمة الله و بركاته
To all members participating on this thread, please keep discussions constructive, positive and on topic. جزاك الله خيرا

Please only post relevant issues to the current topic, otherwise please start a new topic. Jazakumullah
report post quote code quick quote reply
No post ratings
back to top
Rank Image
Jinn's avatar
Unspecified
2,890
Brother
219
Jinn's avatar
#14 [Permalink] Posted on 11th April 2014 08:39


Post above says 'and same goes for others'

'Others' includes all members of forum, anon or not.



جزاك الله خيرا
report post quote code quick quote reply
+2 -0Like x 2
back to top
Rank Image
Jinn's avatar
Unspecified
2,890
Brother
219
Jinn's avatar
#15 [Permalink] Posted on 13th April 2014 11:26
Shaytaan steals good deeds

Shaytaan steals good deeds the way loose change falls through holes in our pockets, if he cannot get us to follow him, then the least he can do is try to corrupt and steal our good deeds i.e. by making a person proud, e.g " I made this masjid", really, even though it was the community's charity and Allah's tawfiq (assistance) and mercy, I or we cannot move an inch without the mercy of our Lord. The mercy of Allah follows us like our shadow, the greater our mercy is for mankind the greater Allah's mercy is for us. The mercy of Allah is manifest and more powerful than any devil as shaytaan said I will make mankind disobey you with sins and Allah responded as long as they seek forgiveness of me I will continue to forgive them, he shaytaan said I will attack them from front, so Allah placed an angel to protect us, shaytaan said I will attack them through their wealth, Allah inspires us to pay zakaat/sadaqah a means of protecting our wealth from the cursed one, he said I will have a share of their children we marry and make supplication and Allah shields and protects our offspring from his exploits. We keep sinning and Allah keeps forgiving us, what a beautiful Lord, should we then not be grateful and rejoice at our circumstances and chances of succeeding, Alhamdu-lillah, thank you Allah for your infinite mercy and forgiveness, indeed all praise and thanks belongs to you. To our brothers and sisters out their who have lost hope, just remember Allah is waiting for you with open arms, as Allah rejoices when his servant repents, it does not matter how far you may be from salah (prayer) or good deeds, everyday is another day and an opportunity to re-establish your connection with Allah, as he never left you, but it was you whom he continuously called but you failed to answer his call, due to your guilt and regret at your deeds, isn't it time you said enough is enough and answer the call of your Lord and break your connection from the chief deceiver (satan) before it's too late.
report post quote code quick quote reply
+2 -0Winner x 2Optimistic x 1
back to top

Jump to page: