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Halal Mortgages?

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#16 [Permalink] Posted on 16th August 2018 16:18
This answer will further clarify it iA.

Mufti Abuhajira wrote:
There is a statement in arabic which says, "For every field has its people".

While we understand that it is most safe to restrict oneself to one scholar and follow him, yet if one has access to multiple scholars then there is nothing wrong with seeking a scholar of expertise in that particular field. For example, if one has to go to a doctor, then one cannot simply stick to one General Practitioner. Instead, one will need to seek out the doctor who specializes in the field for which a medical advice is needed. Hence for a heart disease, it would not serve to seek out a neurologist.

In other terms, if you are looking for guidance in food items and their halal and haram status then it would be beneficial to seek out scholars who do not only understand the fiqhi aspects of halal and haram food, but also has the ability review his judgement based on industrial practices in that field. 

Similarly, if you are looking for guidance in marital dispute, it will best help if you approach a scholar who specializes in mediation and dispute counseling.
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#17 [Permalink] Posted on 16th August 2018 16:57

bint e aisha wrote:
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No.

Because we are commanded to follow the Salaf but we are not commanded to follow an individual (in 2018). Since you can understand Urdu, read the debate between Allamah Qasim Nanotwi (RA) and Nawab Sideeq Hasan Khan (RA) on Taqleed and pay attention to the special point Allamah Qasim Nanotwi (RA) makes about Imam Abu Haneefa (RA) and Allamah Shami (RA), for those who don't understand Urdu he (RA) says, "I am a Muqallid of Imam Abu Haneefa (RA) so speak to me about Imam Abu Haneefa (RA), what Allamah Shami (RA) says or doesn't say is not my concern..."

  1. Imam Abu Haneefa (RA) [699-767]
  2. Ibn Abideen (RA) [1783-1866]

Also read Bukhari lessons of Shaykhul-Hadeeth (Maulana) Zakariyya Kandhalwi (RA) and the pay specific section in the foreword on Taqleed. 

Taqleed of a singlular Madhab has no connection of following a singular Mufti, a Madhab is a collection of rulings over 1200+ years refined and analysed while a singular Mufti is a singular Mufti (i.e. strawberry is Haram is an opinion of a Mufti not of Hanafi Madhab).

You are negating your own point by bringing Madhabs into thediscussion, I am precisely advocating a body of Ulama and not a singular Mufti.If the singular Mufti is with the body of Ulama (fine), otherwise we reject theodd opinion and move on in life.

I know Mufti Faisal Saheb (HA) disagrees with this and that's fine.

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#18 [Permalink] Posted on 16th August 2018 17:23
Muadh_Khan wrote:
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Ok I'll read inshaAllah.

Quote:
strawberry is Haram is an opinion of a Mufti not of Hanafi Madhab


Allah ta'ala has blessed everyone with 'aql and nobody follows Mufti Zar Wali Khan in such views. Please come up with some good examples because no one is going to follow a Mufti in his isolated and absurd opinions.

Quote:
I am precisely advocating a body of Ulama and not a singular Mufti.


You are discussing the scenario of body of Ulama vs a single Mufti with his isolated opinion. Everyone knows the answer. But what to do when there's equal number of reputable Ulama on both sides? Do we literally have to count them like they do in jamhooriat?
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#19 [Permalink] Posted on 16th August 2018 17:25
"bint e aisha wrote:
Please come up with some good examples

Will Prawns do? or is that a bad example?
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#20 [Permalink] Posted on 16th August 2018 17:49
abu mohammed wrote:
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Good example! If you read the answer of Mufti Abuhajira, it gives clear guidance on what to do in such a situation.

Quote:
If the questioner has a question in relation to food, then let him ask C, D, and E to get their expert opinion.

If their answers are unanimous, then there is no further question required.

If they give differing responses between permissibility or impermissibility, then caution demands that one opts for the view of impermissibility.

In this case, if the item which he asked about was in fact permissible, he would have stayed away from it out of caution and gained additional rewards from Allāh.

However, if the item happens to be impermissible (i.e the muftī who gave the fatwā of permissibility erred), then the questioner would have saved himself from something impermissible.


@Brother Muadh, please guide us on what the jamhoor Ulama says about eating prawns.
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#21 [Permalink] Posted on 16th August 2018 18:48
abu mohammed wrote:
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how about 'mortgage on your first property is allowed', for an example?
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#22 [Permalink] Posted on 16th August 2018 20:02
Why have many Islamic scholars stepped away from halal mortgages of so called Islamic banks?

Scholars: Sharia compliance rulings reverse trend

DECEMBER 7, 2009

Read full story in link below.
The Financial Times
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#23 [Permalink] Posted on 17th August 2018 10:40

bint e aisha wrote:
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As I said punches a hole in own argument! The argument is following a solitary (singular) Mufti in all matters after a Mufti is found to be competent, knowledgeable, trustworthy, reliable and pious (which Mufti Zarwali Khan (HA) happens to be). Read the lines below, it is clearly not following a singular Mufti but using judgement call and that is precisely my point.

Note the fact that a layman is calling the opinion of a competent, knowledgeable, trustworthy, reliable and pious Mufti "absurd" which goes against the default recommendation of the article.

Allah ta'ala has blessed everyone with 'aql and nobody follows Mufti Zar Wali Khan in such views. Please come up with some good examples because no one is going to follow a Mufti in his isolated and absurd opinions.

No futher discussion is necessary on the topic because the point is taken, rest is tittle-tattle and circular arguments.

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#24 [Permalink] Posted on 17th August 2018 12:36
Muadh_Khan wrote:
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I see your point. You're right but Mufti Sahab's advice is also appropriate and he has not asked anyone to follow a Mufti in his isolated opinions.
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#25 [Permalink] Posted on 17th August 2018 15:54

bint e aisha wrote:
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 I don't have time to have circular arguments or beating a dead horse after the primary point has been discussed, so you won, I lost.

Thanks
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#26 [Permalink] Posted on 17th August 2018 16:32
Muadh_Khan wrote:
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I don't know why you turn everything into a win/lose situation! Was that some sort of competition which you wanted to win to satisfy your ego?!
That was the last time I discussed anything with you (inshaAllah).

Wassalam
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#27 [Permalink] Posted on 17th August 2018 19:04

bint e aisha wrote:
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Because I value my time and see no value in circular arguments which you wish to have.

Backrgound:

This is the relevant text.

With that in mind, a common layman should find one Muftī that he and his heart completely trusts, and always stick to asking him. To choose this Muftī he should make sure that the Muftī is well-researched enough to give him all the answers. Hence the suggestion is not to find someone who once completed his Iftāʾ course and gained the title of Muftī, rather someone who has continued his research, and actively issues/answers fatāwā. Once a person finds such a Muftī, and his heart is content with him, then he should stop asking multiple Muftiyān, and stick to this particular Muftī. This will make his life so much easier and the focus will be shifted towards fulfilling the rulings instead of researching them and trying to find out which Muftī’s opining seems stronger.

Now that we have so many avenues of different muftis, I recommend that if a person cannot just stick to one mufti all-together, then he should have a set group of Muftiyān for specific field. At first it may seem tedious, but remember that we are not making a huge database of Muftiyān. When an issue arises, one will simply review the listing to see which Muftī to approach for that field. Thereafter handling the responses will become much easier.

If an individual can make such a list with only a single of his most relied Muftī, he makes his life very easy.

The Point:

No matter who you slice, dice it Mufti Faisal Saheb is clearly saying that a person should stick to a singular Mufti. If a person makes a list of:

  1. Mufti A for financial issues
  2. Mufti B for Halal/Haram ingredients
  3. Mufti C for Marital/Divorce issues

It is STILL a singular Mufti!

Which Mufti?

To choose this Muftī he should make sure that the Muftī is well-researched enough to give him all the answers. Hence the suggestion is not to find someone who once completed his Iftāʾ course and gained the title of Muftī, rather someone who has continued his research, and actively issues/answers fatāwā

Disgareement:

I have given an example which you cannot refute and you cannot counter.

  1. You cannot remove Mufti Zarwali Khan (HA) from the creiterion given
  2. You also cannot accept his strawberry Fatwa

Ipso facto you CANNOT follow a Mufti on every single issue and it may lead to problems.

Your mind accepts it but your heart cannot and you still want to argue about a point which you have mentally conceded. What for???

Whether you call it absurd opinion, isolated opnion, a list of Mufti A, B, C, D, E, F, G its the same point.

I have aloready given all of you the choice to say, "I respectfully disagree and in my opinion it is from Islam..." You came with the (wrong) analogy of Madhabs which I explained and then further directed you to read some more but you still want to argue.

Next stage is Mufti Faisal (himself) and I disagree with him (too)...

I have also said that Mufti Faisal can probably quote example x or example where scholars of a city referred to a singular scholar but that still DOES NOT make sticking to a singular Mufti the defacto rule.

P.S: We live in a democracy so if you wish to stick to a singular Mufti go right ahead but there is no argument to make here. That's why I am saying you won, I lost.

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#28 [Permalink] Posted on 7th September 2018 01:24
So back on topic. Is the Home purchase plan by Al Ryan Bank halal? or best case scenario better than a conventional mortgage?

The irony is that I hear Al Ryan branded about a lot, but when ask the ulemah for an official halal stamp, they're unusually quiet.
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#29 [Permalink] Posted on 7th September 2018 12:07

Intrepid wrote:
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My brain is telling me not to post in this thread but my heart and Eemaan requires me to provide assistance to Muslims (wherever I can) so let me get reviled and abused and Allah Ta’ala will reward me, Insha’Allah.

Halal Mortgages are an issue of Ijetheaad and the opinion will differ from Ulama to Ulama. HSBC (Mortgage) which is no longer provided was approved by Mufti Taqi Usmani (HA) but not approved by other Ulama. Therefore you WILL NEVER get a product which will be wholesale and unimonously approved by all Ulama, it is neither a matter of Aqeedah nor unaimous so Ulama will differ.

Everybody reading this thread needs to grasp this reality and understand it.

Ar-Rayyan Mortgage is approved by 3 Scholars:

www.alrayanbank.co.uk/media/291082/home-purchase-plan.pdf

  1. Sheikh Dr Abdul Sattar Abu Ghuddah (Jeddah): www.alrayanbank.co.uk/useful-info-tools/islamic-finance/s...
  2. Mufti Barkatullah (Deoband graduate): ebrahimcollege.org.uk/mufti-abdul-qadir-barkatulla/
  3. Sheikh Nizam Muhammed Saleh Yaqoobi: www.alrayanbank.co.uk/useful-info-tools/islamic-finance/s...

Your choices are dead simple:

  • Consult the Ulama whom your trust (and seek their advice) with a copy of the Mortgage agreement and you can easily get it from the Bank by contacting them
  • Make intention of Taqleed and follow the Ulama mentioned

OR you can keep asking laymen to comment on the matter which is far above the capacity of most people to understand and comment upon.

Jazakallahu Khayran

P.S: Let the abuse begin!


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#30 [Permalink] Posted on 7th September 2018 19:52
abu mohammed wrote:
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I love this advice, whether its the conclusion of that pdf or not
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